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NSA spying row: Denmark helped US gather data on European officials, says report

bbc.com

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Re: NSA spying row: Denmark helped US gather data on European officials, says report

#21

Post by Permit »

quyleanh wrote: post #18
Permit wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I still wonder, what happens if other countries like China, Russia spy on other governments and are disclosed? They will be embargoed by US. Does this happen? Has China faced sanctions after spying on US citizens or stealing trade secrets? Has Russia?

> Does this happen? Has China faced sanctions after spying on US citizens or stealing trade secrets? Has Russia? Yes, it does happen. I've read many news about US claims that Chinese government-backed hacker groups or corporations spying and stealing. And they are embargoed. You can refer to Huawei case.

> You can refer to Huawei case.

I have only surface-level knowledge, but wasn't this case because Huawei was selling components to Iran? Or was it related to spying?

Re: NSA spying row: Denmark helped US gather data on European officials, says report

#22

Post by [deleted] »

f38zf5vdt wrote: post #17
Permit wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I still wonder, what happens if other countries like China, Russia spy on other governments and are disclosed? They will be embargoed by US. Does this happen? Has China faced sanctions after spying on US citizens or stealing trade secrets? Has Russia?

Yeah. For a while now. [1][2] [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/admin... [2] https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/biden-to-an...

[deleted]

Re: NSA spying row: Denmark helped US gather data on European officials, says report

#23

Post by ku-man »

BombNullIsland wrote: post #9
ahmedalsudani wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s a big club and you ain’t in it https://youtu.be/Nyvxt1svxso

I'm a white late-30's politically inactive prole with no social media accounts, a paid off house, solar panels, plug in hybrid, e-bike and large vegetable garden. None of this bullshit really concerns me. It's all just the oligarchs fighting for who gets to momentarily sit at the top of the pile.

Some of us like eat beef and watch Korean dramas in Netflix. Also, some of us have mortgages and large families. So, hinting that the solution to this absurd surveillance society is to live off the grid is disingenuous.

Re: NSA spying row: Denmark helped US gather data on European officials, says report

#24

Post by eloff »

Permit wrote: post #21
quyleanh wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Does this happen? Has China faced sanctions after spying on US citizens or stealing trade secrets? Has Russia? Yes, it does happen. I've read many news about US claims that Chinese government-backed hacker groups or corporations spying and stealing. And they are embargoed. You can refer to Huawei case.

> You can refer to Huawei case. I have only surface-level knowledge, but wasn't this case because Huawei was selling components to Iran? Or was it related to spying?

It was selling components to Iran.

Re: NSA spying row: Denmark helped US gather data on European officials, says report

#25

Post by quyleanh »

Permit wrote: post #21
quyleanh wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Does this happen? Has China faced sanctions after spying on US citizens or stealing trade secrets? Has Russia? Yes, it does happen. I've read many news about US claims that Chinese government-backed hacker groups or corporations spying and stealing. And they are embargoed. You can refer to Huawei case.

> You can refer to Huawei case. I have only surface-level knowledge, but wasn't this case because Huawei was selling components to Iran? Or was it related to spying?

You can refer to this article. US claims Huawei 5G devices can track and spy US and Europe citizens.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/for-h...

Re: NSA spying row: Denmark helped US gather data on European officials, says report

#26

Post by Permit »

f38zf5vdt wrote: post #17
Permit wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I still wonder, what happens if other countries like China, Russia spy on other governments and are disclosed? They will be embargoed by US. Does this happen? Has China faced sanctions after spying on US citizens or stealing trade secrets? Has Russia?

Yeah. For a while now. [1][2] [1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/admin... [2] https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/biden-to-an...

The China sanctions do not appear to have been enacted, but the Russian ones in response to the attack on SolarWinds do. Thanks for the links!

Re: NSA spying row: Denmark helped US gather data on European officials, says report

#27

Post by RcouF1uZ4gsC »

quyleanh wrote: post #8

I still wonder, what happens if other countries like China, Russia spy on other governments and are disclosed? They will be embargoed by US. But why there is nothing happens when US spying other countries? Because US does it with good manner and good intention?

> But why there is nothing happens when US spying other countries? Because US does it with good manner and good intention?

The best way to understand the relationship between the US and Europe is that it is an American Empire in all but name. The provinces of the Empire have a lot of autonomy, but in matters of defense and security they are tied to the Empire.

If you realize that, a lot of things make sense.

Re: NSA spying row: Denmark helped US gather data on European officials, says report

#28

Post by ruined »

BombNullIsland wrote: post #15
peteretep wrote: post #7

The Five Eyes have built a sufficiently valuable asset that the security services of other rich countries all want in. Denmark is in Nine Eyes, so they’ll happily sell out members of Fourteen Eyes (like Germany) to get closer into the circle.

You just assume that every electronic communication is dragneted now. Your phone, your car radio's bluetooth radio, toll transponder, alpr, everything. What I like about the signals-intelligence-only focus is that I can leave my phone at home, hop on an ebike with a legally mandated helmet obscuring my face from cameras, and I'm completely invisible to the state. I just don't exist. Unlike East Germany there's no HUM…

in any area with buildings, there are enough cameras to achieve decent tracking of an individual with a bit of legwork, and that legwork is quickly being automated by amazon et al with ring and similar efforts. newer cars also collect a lot of data that could be looped into such a system so you'd better avoid roads too. and wait til you hear about extreme definition wide angle cameras on aerial platforms

Re: NSA spying row: Denmark helped US gather data on European officials, says report

#29

Post by culturestate »

BombNullIsland wrote: post #15
peteretep wrote: post #7

The Five Eyes have built a sufficiently valuable asset that the security services of other rich countries all want in. Denmark is in Nine Eyes, so they’ll happily sell out members of Fourteen Eyes (like Germany) to get closer into the circle.

You just assume that every electronic communication is dragneted now. Your phone, your car radio's bluetooth radio, toll transponder, alpr, everything. What I like about the signals-intelligence-only focus is that I can leave my phone at home, hop on an ebike with a legally mandated helmet obscuring my face from cameras, and I'm completely invisible to the state. I just don't exist. Unlike East Germany there's no HUM…

> Unlike East Germany there's no HUMINT apparatus in the west or in China

Nobody telegraphs their intentions like the Stasi did, but to believe that no state has developed coordinated efforts to get people to snitch on each other (the most effective Stasi tactic) is...let's say seeing things through an extremely rosy lens.

Re: NSA spying row: Denmark helped US gather data on European officials, says report

#30

Post by MeinBlutIstBlau »

BombNullIsland wrote: post #9
ahmedalsudani wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s a big club and you ain’t in it https://youtu.be/Nyvxt1svxso

I'm a white late-30's politically inactive prole with no social media accounts, a paid off house, solar panels, plug in hybrid, e-bike and large vegetable garden. None of this bullshit really concerns me. It's all just the oligarchs fighting for who gets to momentarily sit at the top of the pile.

I agree with your second statement, I disagree with your first. Every day things get harder and harder not to be a schizoid with a tinfoil hat. I mean cash has got a long way before not being accepted but I wouldnt be shocked if it goes all digital in the next 50 years (meaning credit, debit, ach, PayPal, Venmo, crypto, etc). Mobile phones and cellular data plans are what dominate our lives. It's impossible to get by without them...unless you are willing to be a secluded schizoid (and I'm not saying that in a deragotory sense). I mean that's all fine and dandy and you still be a nice person and whatnot. However, only techie people honestly are aware of it. "Normies" know about it, but they give in because everyone else did and those affluent oligarchs did too. Many of which those "normies" want to be like them. So the times are changing. And sadly not for the better freedom wise.
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