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Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

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Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#211
post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More a matter of business practice in general — The fact that Amazon makes it easier than any other shop is just one reason why I prefer peace of mind over the cheapest price. And yes, the law is in place but most shops make it way too difficult (Acknowledging the reason, time to refund, "Lost" returns, Direct vs. Marketplace, etc.).

You don't have to have a reason to return online order within 14 days.

You're right. That doesn't mean that some shops won't ask and expect an answer though. So even though you're legally not required to do so, you'll have to go through an argument about that with the shop, which is annoying and time consuming.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#212
post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you still buying CDs?

It’s rather nice to buy unusual CDs and FLAC them. I like to do it from time to time.

Or vinyl albums, adds an extra dimension to listening to music.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#213
post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazon Japan is incredible. I ordered a Japanese book from them and it arrived the next afternoon (to the UK!) Another time I was in Japan and I needed a specific bluetooth keyboard for the tablet I was using, delivered to a convenience store pick-up point in the deep north of the country in the middle of winter, ordered with my UK credit card, and no problem, it was there the next day. I can't imagine the amount of…

Delivering in a Hokkaido winter sounds like an epic undertaking considering the amount of snow.

Aomori, but yes it's amazing that everything keeps working in those conditions (in general, not just Amazon).

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#214
post #44

I've placed approx. 15k orders with Amazon Germany in 20 years and have probably had less than 100 issues, mostly with FBA sellers. I get an answer from CS within 10 minutes and 1-day shipments are on time ~98%. Refunds are issued as soon as I drop the package in the return box. Call me a fan. The best experience is still Amazon JP but returns are a little more complicated (Even within Japan) — Obviously b/c you more…

> Obviously b/c you more or less do not return stuff in JP

Not so obvious to me. Could you elaborate on what you mean here, sounds intriguing.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#215
Like most people, I've ordered a lot of packages (hundreds?) on Amazon and almost never had a problem. In the rare case of a problem, Amazon would instantly refund me. But almost all those orders are under $1000. Everything changes when you have a problem with an expensive order. Amazon has a price threshold where the support system is different and the normal CS people are powerless.

During lockdown, I ordered a Sony camera and lens that was in the $5k+ range. The package went "missing" with the shipper with obvious fake tracking data, like multiple "customer not home" delivery attempts timestamped at 12am in the morning. The packages never showed up. Amazon kept saying it was the shipper's fault and the shipper said it was Amazon's responsibility. Lots of tweets, etc, got me nowhere.

In the end Amazon finally refunded me, but it was a nightmare. They wouldn't even talk to me until I waited a number of days after the package was late and even then all they would say is that it had to be escalated to management who would review the issue eventually. Even when they finally agreed the package was lost, I had to wait for another management review to actually get the refund issued. They had my money tied up for weeks with no recourse for a package they never even delivered. I can only imagine how bad it would be if the shipper claimed it was delivered.

My recommendation is to skip Amazon for anything expensive or at high risk of shipper theft/fraud. Your customer experience will not be the same as when they lose a $10 package. They will treat you like a criminal no matter what your past history with Amazon is.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#216
post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm genuinely surprised that people have such vastly different experiences with Amazon. I made 231 orders with them last year(lockdown....) And haven't had a problem with a single one. Couple times I wanted to return something they just refunded me without asking to send the item back. Everything arrives next day, always(here in UK anyway), and the customer support is stellar compared to literally anywhere else. Anyo…

I wonder if there are regions (or countries) which are worse? Amazon in Germany is also great, so far. I’m like you - I’ve ordered so many things from Amazon this last year or so (new circumstances plus pandemic lockdown) and literally not one problem of the sort described. I can think of two items out of hundreds which weren’t on time (one, Amazons’s logistics made it a whole day late, and one was the seller’s issue…

It's enough that they screw up 0.01 - 0.1% of orders. They are big enough, those people will be loud and not those without issues.

On HN I put comment below because I had some issue - if I had not, such comment would have too little value to post.

I did receive many things without issues and have also received books that looked way worse than if you gave them to a toddler. It's bizarre - they started with books and books are items that are trivial to pack securely.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#217
post #178
post #158

Whenever there's an article about an obvious outlier case (still outrageous in its own of course) you can assume that the top comment will be general complaints about said company's decline, often not representative of people's experience as a whole.

The only outlier here is the cost. General complaints can be assumed to be reprensentive of these people's experiences, or they wouldn't be here complaining, no?

Obviously not by judging by the replies. People are not upvoting that comment because they can relate, but because they love to hate on big companies.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#218
Amazon (EU) is garbage. I ordered a high-end laptop from the Amazon Warehouses and they cancelled my order after 2 months. I kept calling them in the meanwhile many times and they were bs me with "everything ok" "your order will be shipped" "won't worry" until they cancelled my order without a reason.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#219
post #35

This is certainly one of those instances where I'd raise hell, but I actually avoid trying to file lost item claims with Amazon for smaller ticket items. I know they have automated systems in place to prevent fraud, and I'm terrified that reporting for smaller ticket items will get my Amazon account banned. I've had a friend have this happen with his Doordash account; the sushi place he orders from a lot was pretty b…

That's perverse. You shouldn't have to self-censor out of fear. The fact that Amazon (Doordash, Google, ...) can get away with just cancelling people's accounts willy nilly and they'd have no recourse is a gaping hole in regulations. BTW, it's off-topic, but this right here is the among best arguments we can make for strong privacy, and against mass surveillance. If people are willing to swallow monetary damage out o…

Why companies should not have right to cancel their relationship with person for non-discriminatory reasons? And constant complaints and errors on aggregate sounds entirely reasonable reason.

If same thing kept happening inside non-online business I think we would find it pretty okay...

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't have to have a reason to return online order within 14 days.

You're right. That doesn't mean that some shops won't ask and expect an answer though. So even though you're legally not required to do so, you'll have to go through an argument about that with the shop, which is annoying and time consuming.

This is not a thing. At least in Germany I never once had anyone ask me why I want to return before I could. 90% of the time you already have a return label in the package. Worse case you don’t and you cannot even request one through the website, you send an email and get the label.

I was only ever asked about my return _after_ it was issued by Charles Tyrwhitt after I ordered and returned a good number of items (due to their fit being all over the place). That was fair IMO.

On the other hand Amazon has numerous times shown that if you return too much (or don’t behave due to some other opaque metric) your account can get suspended. Even my account was suspended once, though I am only a moderate shopper and have returned less than 10 items over my 18 years membership. I raised the issue with support and asked why (there weren’t even any returns around that time) and they could not tell me but reinstated my account. Good demonstration of power and a reminder to move away from using kindles.

Amazon returns may be easy until you cross some threshold and end up on their bad side.

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