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Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

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Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#141

Post by hughrr »

texasbigdata wrote: post #87
gambiting wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm genuinely surprised that people have such vastly different experiences with Amazon. I made 231 orders with them last year(lockdown....) And haven't had a problem with a single one. Couple times I wanted to return something they just refunded me without asking to send the item back. Everything arrives next day, always(here in UK anyway), and the customer support is stellar compared to literally anywhere else. Anyo…

Same with roughly the same package volume annually over 8+ years. Literally the only thing lost was due to a historic weather event and Amazon still took care of it. Maybe with commodity household goods it’s different than with higher value items or with electronics.

Also depends on your reputation as a buyer on Amazon I think. If you order lots of high value items and one goes missing they treat you differently than if you made one high value purchase.

I’ve run a huge pile of apple kit through them in the last two years and when a Mac mini disappeared from my doorstep they refunded without question.

The Mac mini did make a reappearance a week later as it was dumped in someone’s porch down the road and they brought it back round. Spoke to customer services and they sent me a return label to send it back.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#142

Post by marban »

ruph123 wrote: post #131
marban wrote: post #44

I've placed approx. 15k orders with Amazon Germany in 20 years and have probably had less than 100 issues, mostly with FBA sellers. I get an answer from CS within 10 minutes and 1-day shipments are on time ~98%. Refunds are issued as soon as I drop the package in the return box. Call me a fan. The best experience is still Amazon JP but returns are a little more complicated (Even within Japan) — Obviously b/c you more…

Maybe the reason for this is more consumer friendly laws? In the EU you can return any* online/telephone ordered purchase within 14 days (among other laws). *Exceptions are software, digital products, etc.

More a matter of business practice in general — The fact that Amazon makes it easier than any other shop is just one reason why I prefer peace of mind over the cheapest price. And yes, the law is in place but most shops make it way too difficult (Acknowledging the reason, time to refund, "Lost" returns, Direct vs. Marketplace, etc.).

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#143

Post by cunidev »

> Given the risks associated with buying online, some customers are resorting to filming the process of unboxing expensive gear in order to create proof in the event that an order has not been correctly fulfilled.

That is exactly what I do for every >300€ purchase I make online. Otherwise, refund without "video evidence" becomes impossible for the majority of platforms.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#144

Post by peteretep »

hughrr wrote: post #141
texasbigdata wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same with roughly the same package volume annually over 8+ years. Literally the only thing lost was due to a historic weather event and Amazon still took care of it. Maybe with commodity household goods it’s different than with higher value items or with electronics.

Also depends on your reputation as a buyer on Amazon I think. If you order lots of high value items and one goes missing they treat you differently than if you made one high value purchase. I’ve run a huge pile of apple kit through them in the last two years and when a Mac mini disappeared from my doorstep they refunded without question. The Mac mini did make a reappearance a week later as it was dumped in someone’s…

> Also depends on your reputation as a buyer on Amazon I think

Probably. There’ll be some people who can rely on their reputation with their CC company too to do a chargeback.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#145

Post by ohmaigad »

marban wrote: post #142
ruph123 wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe the reason for this is more consumer friendly laws? In the EU you can return any* online/telephone ordered purchase within 14 days (among other laws). *Exceptions are software, digital products, etc.

More a matter of business practice in general — The fact that Amazon makes it easier than any other shop is just one reason why I prefer peace of mind over the cheapest price. And yes, the law is in place but most shops make it way too difficult (Acknowledging the reason, time to refund, "Lost" returns, Direct vs. Marketplace, etc.).

You don't have to have a reason to return online order within 14 days.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#146

Post by ricardobayes »

iagovar wrote: post #59
patd wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m in Europe. Earlier this year, I ordered from Amazon Japan, the package arrived quicker than things I had ordered earlier on a European Amazon and it was insanely well packaged.

I guess a lot depends on who and how they pay to deliver. I got an internal x260 battery (that can't configure properly in Linux, if anyone knows about it) a few days ago and has been a disaster. In the case of Spain their customer support is fine, but it falls flat because delivery is a shitshow.

Even more so in the Canaries where we need to pay a lot of handling fees to receive the packages unless you want to do the customs process yourself. On a 200€ headphones I needed to pay 44€ of taxes and handling fees that was shipped from Valencia.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#147

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

zerocrates wrote: post #63
malwarebytess wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anything over a few hundred bucks is playing with fire. I bought an iphone through them (Amazon sold, not 3rd party) last year and had to do the same thing the couple did: chargeback on credit card. They refused to investigate and flat out accused me of fraud. Gee, maybe it's the low paid disgruntled employees from warehouse worker to contracted out Prime delivery guy stealing shit? Nah, it's the guy who spent tens o…

I wonder actually where this stuff happens typically. Clearly some seems to happen before things even get to Amazon, that whole counterfeit commingling thing you hear about, where the 3rd-party stock gets used even if you buy from Amazon directly. (How this could be worth it to do at all vs. the reputational damage is unclear but I guess they're always chasing the small efficiencies... still you'd think it would be e…

> You can tell they're increasing the scrutiny on drivers as well with them having to take photos of the delivered item, and they've clearly always been closely tracked on time and location.

Some time ago, my wife ordered something from Amazon, and it was reported as “delivered,” but the photo was of someone else’s doorstep.

She had no problem getting them to ship a replacement, but it added a few days to the process.

The “last mile” stuff is crazy. I sometimes see two Amazon Prime Sprinters on the same street, at the same time.

It was much worse, when it was done by independent contractors. We would see these folks driving around, with so many boxes in the cab of their vans, they had to make a hole to see through.

Looked like an episode of Hoarders.

I’m not surprised they have issues. The system is basically strained to the max. It’s a miracle that it works as well as it does.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#148

Post by marban »

ohmaigad wrote: post #145
marban wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More a matter of business practice in general — The fact that Amazon makes it easier than any other shop is just one reason why I prefer peace of mind over the cheapest price. And yes, the law is in place but most shops make it way too difficult (Acknowledging the reason, time to refund, "Lost" returns, Direct vs. Marketplace, etc.).

You don't have to have a reason to return online order within 14 days.

It makes a difference as to who's responsible for return fees.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#149

Post by thedufer »

cbmuser wrote: post #17

> This was despite the fact that when boxed the Sony a1 weighs 3.22 lb (1.46 kg), and the Chiles’ package was listed by UPS as weighing only 2 lb (900 g). Not sure why Amazon was still arguing at this point. If UPS confirms the package was basically empty, then Amazon has no reason to believe the customer was lying.

That doesn't seem to prove anything at all? It's a 1.6 lb camera. Weighing in at 1.2 lbs short is either a bad scale or a lot of accessories missing, but it definitely does not corroborate a missing camera.

Re: Amazon refused to refund $7k after shipping an empty box instead of a Sony A1

#150

Post by herpderperator »

gambiting wrote: post #94
herpderperator wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not true for every item. Items can be shipped and sold by a third party even if bought on Amazon.com. It's up to the buyer to check this when purchasing. The easiest way to tell is to check if the item is 'Prime' or not, but even then it's better to check who is selling and shipping. Edit: I am describing the process as it is now. I am not saying that it should be this way.

No, if you buy an item on Amazon.com then it's on Amazon.com to make sure you have a good experience. As a customer I literally don't care who is fulfilling the purchase, I'm making the purchase on Amazon.com and my money is clearly going to Amazon.com according to my bank statements. If they decide to work with unscrupulous 3rd parties then that's on them, not on me.

There's obviously a misunderstanding with my statement. I am not talking about what should or shouldn't be happening, or what is morally right, or what the ideal experience is. I'm warning people that unfortunately Amazon does not operate the way many people think. Of course I do agree that Amazon should be the sole seller and that if you buy something from Amazon you should expect to receive it from Amazon.

I am simply stating facts as to how the website operates today. Right now, it's possible to order an item on the Amazon.com website that does not come from Amazon.com at all. It can be "shipped and sold" by a complete third party. Most items are shipped by Amazon, but it's not difficult to find items that are just listed on Amazon but the entire sale/shipping process is done by the third party.

The parent comment:

> If you buy on the Amazon.com website it’s on Amazon to deliver your order and provide a good shipping experience.

is simply false, because that's not how Amazon operates today. It is literally wrong because it does not apply to all items on Amazon. That statement is only true if something is fulfilled by Amazon, which includes items "Shipped and sold by Amazon.com" and "Sold by , fulfilled by Amazon". Fulfilled by Amazon means it's located at one of its many warehouses and Amazon ships it in their Amazon boxes.

If I misinterpreted the comment, then my mistake.

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