Live data from Hacker News

The only Buddhist region in Europe

dw.com

141–150 of 195 posts

Re: The only Buddhist region in Europe

#141
post #138

Tangentially related, there is a Greek influence on Buddhism in East Asia because Buddhism arrived in China via the Greek Bactrian kingdom. The Buddha as depicted in East Asia is wearing Greek robes and there are elements of Greek philosophy in Buddhism as practiced in East Asia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greco-Buddhism

Indeed, before the Greeks The Buddha would most commonly only be depicted by his absence, an empty chair or foot prints most famously. It's amazing that the iconography of a religion so ancient and "exotic" is so significantly shaped by European culture.

> It's amazing that the iconography of a religion so ancient and "exotic" is so significantly shaped by European culture.

It's more an instance of convergence and mutual influence. Hellenistic philosophy (read: immediately after Socrates) went down a few different lines. The one with the largest influence in the West was the Academic line, concerned with empirical observations and theory making.

But another major line was about how to live well, and focused primarily on ethics and the virtues. Today, the most well known school in this line is Stoicism, and this approach to philosophy really has a lot of overlap with Buddhism. The Bactrians were extremely well primed to be receptive of some "wisdom from the East" (like the type Pythagoras was supposed to have received) that covered a lot of the same topics as Hellenistic philosophy.

By the time Buddhism was meaningfully re-introduced to European academics (starting around the 17th century, but culminating with Schopenhaur in the 19th), several writers once again remarked on the similarities between the Hellenistic and Buddhist traditions.

Re: The only Buddhist region in Europe

#142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Christians have always been 1/3 scholar, 1/3 philosopher, and 1/3 priest. The premise of Christianity is "revelation". That a higher power revealed knowledge to humans that is not knowable by any other means. That there is revealed knowledge has meant that Christians spend much of their time thinking about and working out the implications of their revealed knowledge and trying to fit it into the rest of the world. Ho…

What knowledge would that be? At least in these Catholicism-dominated parts, that knowledge seems to look something like "you better watch it because you're a sinner and might end up burning in hell, except that Jesus saved you because he loves you, but for some reason despite being saved you are still a sinner and might end up burning in hell". You kind of sound like that's not the premise you mean.

The whole "Catholic guilt" thing is of often pointed to as some whacky vehicle of control, which is a total mischaracterization of what that perspective is meant to do.

Many religions and philosophers understand the idea that humans are not basically good people. They are generally self centered and not sacrificial. So to say that Catholicism or Christianity is strange for placing emphasis on our "fallenness" is a little unfair IMHO.

The daily struggle of a Christian is to strive to rid one's self of their sinful desires (selfish / evil) and live as Christ commands. This a continual process, and one that cannot be stopped. If one just "gets tired" of being a Christian, and lives differently, then they are in danger of losing their salvation.

I only go into this detail to illustrate that there is more to "Catholic guilt" than a flippant "critique".

Re: The only Buddhist region in Europe

#143
post #100
post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a child I had a subconscious assumption that Christianity wasn't rational, and maintained that view into my mid-twenties. Thankfully, I had the drive to do research on it, and an open enough mind to accept it, because I was ready to reject Christianity completely for a short period. I know this view isn't popular, but today, I see Christianity as the most rational philosophy/religion out there. I think it's been w…

You don't need to know much about it. Christians believe in a god. That's open and shut right there.

I mean, these days, at least in Europe, quite a lot of people who identify as Christians _don't_, or certainly not a personal god.

Re: The only Buddhist region in Europe

#145
post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Big Bang has physical evidence for its existence that you can personally verify.

Yes, but in practice who follows it to that level of detail? From a layperson's point of view, are the astrophysicists that much different than a priestly caste? I believe the physicists, but I don't think that by itself makes me a particularly rigorous thinker. In the ancient world I probably would have believed the priests, because it was what made sense to people. And for better or for worse we have lots of eviden…

> From a layperson's point of view, are the astrophysicists that much different than a priestly caste?

I have yet to see an astrophysicists burn you on a cross because you don't "believe" in the big bang.

Re: The only Buddhist region in Europe

#146

It seems weird Buddhism is such a minor religion in Europe while it is so rational, based on individual experience (rather than belief) gained through reproducible applied self-regulation techniques, backed by neuroscience and explained with consistent philosophical logic.

Western/secular Buddhism popularized in the west is generally not the same as Buddhism practiced in Buddhist countries. The actual Buddhist religion teachings can include, depending on the branch: - Hell and heaven realms where you can get reincarnated into if you've lived an especially bad or good life - Various gods and demons - A timeline spanning trillions of years and hundreds of Buddhas - "Celestial Buddhas" th…

The same also happened with Daoism. The West took the philosophical part and ignored for many years the cultural aspects, belief system, and worshipping rituals (i.e., the religion) behind it. Until some scientists pointed out (quite recently actually, if I remember correctly) that you cannot just do that.

I don't know much about Daoism and Buddhism, but I know a guy who compliments people in the West who claim to be Daoists on their excellent Chinese. Most of them don't get the joke (it seems many important texts have never been translated).

Concerning Buddhism, don't certain sub-branches of Zen buddhism come quite close to the Western "no magic" version?

Re: The only Buddhist region in Europe

#147
post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, before the Greeks The Buddha would most commonly only be depicted by his absence, an empty chair or foot prints most famously. It's amazing that the iconography of a religion so ancient and "exotic" is so significantly shaped by European culture.

> It's amazing that the iconography of a religion so ancient and "exotic" is so significantly shaped by European culture. It's more an instance of convergence and mutual influence. Hellenistic philosophy (read: immediately after Socrates) went down a few different lines. The one with the largest influence in the West was the Academic line, concerned with empirical observations and theory making. But another major lin…

Even the "live well" philosophies were heavily influenced by India. Democritus, the father of antique materialism which lead to Epicurus and Lucretius was heavily influenced by gymnosophists when he traveled to India.

Realized this when I was talking about it with an Indian Colleague and when I mention the principals of materialism she immediately recognized elements of her own religion.

Re: The only Buddhist region in Europe

#148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's amazing that the iconography of a religion so ancient and "exotic" is so significantly shaped by European culture. It's more an instance of convergence and mutual influence. Hellenistic philosophy (read: immediately after Socrates) went down a few different lines. The one with the largest influence in the West was the Academic line, concerned with empirical observations and theory making. But another major lin…

Even the "live well" philosophies were heavily influenced by India. Democritus, the father of antique materialism which lead to Epicurus and Lucretius was heavily influenced by gymnosophists when he traveled to India. Realized this when I was talking about it with an Indian Colleague and when I mention the principals of materialism she immediately recognized elements of her own religion.

I never realized that Democritus traveled to India. What an amazing journey that must have been.

Re: The only Buddhist region in Europe

#149
post #138

Tangentially related, there is a Greek influence on Buddhism in East Asia because Buddhism arrived in China via the Greek Bactrian kingdom. The Buddha as depicted in East Asia is wearing Greek robes and there are elements of Greek philosophy in Buddhism as practiced in East Asia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greco-Buddhism

Indeed, before the Greeks The Buddha would most commonly only be depicted by his absence, an empty chair or foot prints most famously. It's amazing that the iconography of a religion so ancient and "exotic" is so significantly shaped by European culture.

Hellenism is not a strictly European culture. Most of the hellenic world population lived in Africa or the middle east. These were much larger population centers than cities greece, italy, or anywhere else in the European Mediterranean at the time.

Re: The only Buddhist region in Europe

#150

It seems weird Buddhism is such a minor religion in Europe while it is so rational, based on individual experience (rather than belief) gained through reproducible applied self-regulation techniques, backed by neuroscience and explained with consistent philosophical logic.

Have you been to Europe? Many countries there masquerade as the developed nations seen in Northwest and Central Europe, while actually unaffiliated countries around the world aspire to be seen as developed.

A lot of irrational things happen at the cultural and state level in Europe, with an iron thumb of redundancy keeping those silly states in check.

Post reply on HN