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Microsoft has turned the Surface Duo into a handheld Xbox

theverge.com

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Re: Microsoft has turned the Surface Duo into a handheld Xbox

#121

Post by fullstop »

TMWNN wrote: post #118
fullstop wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've considered getting a larger Android tablet for the purpose of playing games on GamePass /xCloud with a paired xbox controller. It works quite well on my phone, but the screen is kind of small or my eyes are bad. The piece missing for me, currently, is the lack of vibration support. I did not appreciate how many tactile cues today's games have until it was missing. For example, in Sea of Thieves, there is a "clun…

>I've considered getting a larger Android tablet for the purpose of playing games on GamePass /xCloud with a paired xbox controller. As far as I know, [there is still no tablet-sized controller with proper analog triggers]( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZF-wWUSq3Cc#t=12m10s ). >The piece missing for me, currently, is the lack of vibration support. My understanding is that this is an Android issue. Nvidia added vibr…

I would be propping the tablet up on a table and using an Xbox one controller. I do this with my phone (OnePlus 7t) today, but the screen is a bit small.

I'm just waiting for some sort of vibration support before I get a tablet, knowing that it's an Android issue and that a specific Android version may eventually be required in order to use it.

Re: Microsoft has turned the Surface Duo into a handheld Xbox

#122

Post by megablast »

bartread wrote: post #100
partiallypro wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can still use a physical controller with this, and it's obviously at a proof of concept phase.

I did mention using a physical controller toward the end of the post. But then it's unclear what the advantage is versus doing that with your existing phone (as I say, unless you already have a Duo).

Bigger screen. Better Sound. Is this just not obvious to you??

Re: Microsoft has turned the Surface Duo into a handheld Xbox

#123

Post by [deleted] »

grillvogel wrote: post #106
smolder wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Verge made a video about how to build a computer at one point and it was full of laughably bad advice. I'd say they're more of a culture blog than tech experts/analysts. Hardware stories come across as uncritical ads.

werent they bankrolled by microsoft? or was that polygon?

[deleted]

Re: Microsoft has turned the Surface Duo into a handheld Xbox

#124

Post by bobthepanda »

megablast wrote: post #122
bartread wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did mention using a physical controller toward the end of the post. But then it's unclear what the advantage is versus doing that with your existing phone (as I say, unless you already have a Duo).

Bigger screen. Better Sound. Is this just not obvious to you??

The bottom half is the controller, so you really only get a 5.6 in screen.

A switch screen is bigger than that, and if sound is your major concern it also docks into an actual TV with audio output. Presumably if you’re playing handheld headphones are no big deal (in contrast, not using headphones just pisses off everyone around you)

Re: Microsoft has turned the Surface Duo into a handheld Xbox

#125

Post by SV_BubbleTime »

modshatereality wrote: post #119
macspoofing wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or you can pair a controller.

The real enemy is latency. Physical switches that trigger an IRQ directly to be handled by the program within microseconds would be ideal for human gaming (edit: or directly reading hardware registers). Everything else is just another weak option, pretending to be a gaming system. Also while I'm on the topic, F microsoft for still preventing me from developing software for their system independently.

The latency on the proprietary WiFi woth Xbox controllers is best in the industry. The Bluetooth latency is surely minimum connection interval which doe BT5 is what, 7.5ms or so...

> be handled by the program within microseconds would be ideal for human gaming

Ok, well, for the rest of us humans who aren’t eGaming Professional Athletes staying sharp every moment away from the “the dojo”, I think pairing a controller is probably fine. Yea, microsecond direct register reads though... makes a lot of sense for cloud gaming.

Re: Microsoft has turned the Surface Duo into a handheld Xbox

#126

Post by SV_BubbleTime »

bartread wrote: post #99
systemvoltage wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now extend your argument to a large equipment that travels at lethal speeds on 4 wheels. It's gotten so bad that I am surprised they've have kept the steering wheel intact and still analog.

FWIW I 100% agree with you about touch controls in cars. I even considered drawing a parallel between the two but thought my post was already long enough.

Automotive EE here, touch controls on vehicles are because it’s cheaper than buttons, dials, and switches... by a lot. Not to mention single supplier, remove the testing an validation for the switch bank, remove the firmware and ECU requirements (you didn’t think there was a wire behind that switch or dial did you?), and they don’t need it “done” before the vehicle goes to production (we have tens of thousands of cars in lots waiting forever flashes before they can ship), so if the HVAC dial is buggy, so what? Fix it by the time they hit the dealer for inspection.

Everyone designing the car knows that touch is dumb. But marketing and bean counters love it.

Re: Microsoft has turned the Surface Duo into a handheld Xbox

#127

Post by SV_BubbleTime »

systemvoltage wrote: post #83
bartread wrote: post #76

No, no, no, no, no, no, NO! Touch controls for most games suck (I've tried). Replicating somebody's Xbox controller on the second screen sucks . It's unendingly annoying when you die over and over in a game because your thumb or finger wasn't in quite the right place to fire or move in a particular direction. Not to mention, the Duo is ####ing expensive: top-end iPhone kind of money for the unlocked variant. If you r…

Now extend your argument to a large equipment that travels at lethal speeds on 4 wheels. It's gotten so bad that I am surprised they've have kept the steering wheel intact and still analog.

Steering wheel is still “analog” in some new cars but it isn’t actually connected to anything. Super crazy that we’re doing a ton of work to make it feel right by adding back in pull and vibration.

The goal is to disconnect the wheel from the tie rod because “we know better” for accident avoidance, self driving, and it’ll help with packaging.

Re: Microsoft has turned the Surface Duo into a handheld Xbox

#128

Post by SV_BubbleTime »

techrat wrote: post #11
jayd16 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just pair a controller.

Thus defeating the entire purpose of having a two screen setup where one screen acts like a controller. You'd be better off getting a larger screen phone and a bracket to clip the phone to a physical controller. Especially with one that has as many buttons as the XBox controller does.

One of the best games I played last year was Outer Wilds. Would have played fine with a touch controller if it’s all I had.

I think some people are making too big a deal about this article. If you don’t like it, don’t buy it.

Re: Microsoft has turned the Surface Duo into a handheld Xbox

#129

Post by passivate »

whatshisface wrote: post #117
passivate wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if in the future you could have micro-fluid channels underneath the screen where you can pump fluid to create raised bumps for the buttons. I remember seeing a techdemo years ago, but haven't seen it materialize in a product. This seems to be a good fit.

https://la.disneyresearch.com/publication/tactile-rendering-... Disney has been working on this, although their method is different from your proposal.

This is the one I was thinking of..

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/01/new-microfluidics-pa...

Re: Microsoft has turned the Surface Duo into a handheld Xbox

#130

Post by passivate »

bartread wrote: post #115
passivate wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if in the future you could have micro-fluid channels underneath the screen where you can pump fluid to create raised bumps for the buttons. I remember seeing a techdemo years ago, but haven't seen it materialize in a product. This seems to be a good fit.

This is the closest story I found: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/technology-35232827 . But I do remember, and I'm sure it was also on the BBC, a piece several years ago where they demonstrated "physical buttons" the the form of reconfigurable raised bumps on a touch screen that was, I think, either on a phone or a small tablet. I just can't find it now unfortunately. If a company could get that to work well, and it w…

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014/01/new-microfluidics-pa...
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