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How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

jeremyaboyd.com

321–330 of 638 posts

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#321
post #190

It’s a commercial linux distro without bugs, and pretty. As a dev, I like how most things work exactly as they would on a linux host, yet the laptop (hardware) is decent and usability of the OS on par. For non-devs, just the shared folders via icloud, airdrop, photos shared/synced - most things that aren’t even that advanced bring most value imo

You must not use macOS that much if you think it's close to linux or has no bugs.

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On literally every other operating system. I've used dozens of platforms, some of them pretty obscure, some of them hobbyist, some of them were purpose built for hardware that stopped being manufactured 20, 30 or more years ago, and all of them supported return as a trigger in menus, be it graphical or text based. Finder really is the odd ball with regards to binding it to rename.

I understand the frustration and I'm with you that Finder is atrocious. My head-cannon about this is that for consistency within macos, all actions must be cmd+something, so is cmd+O for opening a file. In the terminal you can also use the "open" command which opens the file or the directory (I use "open ." a lot, I find faster navigating in the shell that in the finder).

> all actions must be cmd+something

Which is why I always try Cmd+R for renaming a file and then nothing happens.

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#323

Recent M1 user here - I had a PowerPC mac back in the Leopard/Tiger days. I thought OSx would have come on leaps and bounds since then. It's....more or less unchanged. As well as this crazy installer thing, there's quite a bit about Macs that just seems off.. My list of "things that don't seem right" as a long term Windows/ChromeOS user - Window snapping isn't built in outside of fullscreen mode (seriously?!) - Sleep…

> The Finder is either named ironically or I'm not getting it - file paths are obscured, seeing file details is hidden behind a dialog.

View -> Show Path Bar and Show Preview

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#324
post #14

I bought a Mac in 2014 after a lifetime of using Windows. I never understood why people called it easier to use than Windows. Maybe this sentiment is a holdover from an earlier era when people would mindlessly run executables and zip files attached in emails and AIM messages. From a UI perspective, it's 90% identical to windows. From a UX perspective though, something fundamental like Finder is still not up to the jo…

The Finder is atrocious. It's the worst default macOS app and probably the worst program period I've ever used. It's been so dumbed down that it's basically unusable for anyone slightly experienced. - There's no way to create an empty file - There's no easy way to cut a file/folder (Cmd-x doesn't work) - There's no (?) way to keep everything consistently sorted and aligned - ~~Tags are useless and just take up space…

> There's no easy way to cut a file/folder (Cmd-x doesn't work)

You don't need cut for files, you either want to duplicate the file or move it. For moving you copy it (cmd-c) and then move with cmd-opt-v.

Cut doesn't really make sense for files. With text you cut out the text into a clipboard. Where does the file go when you cut it? Nowhere. There is no place where you can see that you had already cut a file but it's waiting for you to make a mistake and move it somewhere by accident.

Mac has a better duplicate/move UX paradigm and more appropriate for files & folders.

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And why can't you ever 'close' Finder? One can only hide it.

Why can't you close Windows Explorer?

You can. explorer.exe may still be running as a process, but visually its presence can be eliminated from the GUI.

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#326
post #172

I just helped a friend who is a lifetime windows user set up her new MBP M1. I was reminded how un-intuitive things are and how useful UI elements are hidden in the name of "simplicity". A lot of it for her is centered around the finder and accessing files in general. The two biggest issues she had was: 1) finder not easily acting as an image viewer. Eg, she had an SD card from her camera, and wanted to quickly scan…

1) hit space for Quick Look, then scroll through? Or use column view. 2) home folder is listed on the Sidebar by default (its name is the user short name, ie its actual name). If that is not there for some reason, go to Finder -> Preferences -> Sidebar.

Thanks. Again, I've been using a mac on and off for almost 20 years and didn't realize there was a way to enable finder to view the home folder. I wonder if the option just didn't exist back in ~2003 or so..

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#327
post #182
post #14

I bought a Mac in 2014 after a lifetime of using Windows. I never understood why people called it easier to use than Windows. Maybe this sentiment is a holdover from an earlier era when people would mindlessly run executables and zip files attached in emails and AIM messages. From a UI perspective, it's 90% identical to windows. From a UX perspective though, something fundamental like Finder is still not up to the jo…

I for the love of me, can't understand how to use a macbook. I don't mean being productive on it. I mean: how to open something or how clicks work. It might simply be the fact that I've never used a mac as a primary device. But, clicks, navigating the explorer and settings menus seem to be a lot simpler on windows. It also seems to be almost malicious in punishing you for using something that isn't a 1st party applic…

I feel the same way when I’m forced to use Windows or a Linux desktop.

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why is it that when I click Finder, nothing actually opens? This would be an example of the 10% of the UI which isn't identical. One of the fundamental differences between macOS and Windows is the menu bar. There's only one at a time, and it belongs to the program which has the focus. A corollary of this is that you don't need a window to have a program. It's not just Finder, most macOS programs are perfectly happy…

There's nothing at all wrong with the behavior, and it's perfectly logical once you understand what is going on, but it's certainly not intuitive. It's a bit of an odd mental model that's (as far as I can tell) specific to OSX. I find OSX to be generally pretty logical and easy to understand, but certainly no more _intuitive_ than something like Windows. Another way of saying this: if I took someone who didn't know h…

I don't think desktop GUIs can or should be 'intuitive'.

They should be consistent, discoverable, and customizable.

I give macOS full marks for consistency, and a passing grade for customizable, but it's hardly discoverable! I read these kinds of HN posts because of all the little tips and tricks I find.

Operating systems used to come with a thick manual, and you could buy an even thicker "missing manual" book at the local bookstore. macOS could use one of those.

Re: How Intuitive Are Macs Really?

#330

I think apple lost interest in the desktop years ago and are eternally surprised it's still lasting, run as an afterthough. Why is deleting a file from a usb stick to free up space so fiddly? No one has ever taken the time to really think through how things work.

Are you fucking kidding? How do you explain the M1?

M1 can be explained by consolidating iOS and macOS so that less effort is spent on the desktop. M1 machines are very close to iPhones when it comes to the boot process and security model, and iOS features are now infiltrating the desktop like widgets and even the ability to run iOS apps on desktop (used to be Marzipan/Catalyst but it still meant the apps had to be compiled for it, but now macOS on M1 is technically capable of running raw iOS apps directly).
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