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Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

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Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#541

Post by throayobviousl »

addicted wrote: post #538
akelly wrote: post #441

This won't really do anything for availability or reducing scalper pricing. Miners are a sizeable proportion of sales but far from the majority. Gamers will be able to buy more of these GPUs but less of the non-LHR or AMD GPU's. GPU prices won't actually change. The real reason Nvidia is doing this is that when mining profitability inevitably drops, either because of a crypto price crash or Ethereum moving to Proof o…

Edited to remove incorrect info.

Nvidia literally sells mining cards that do not have outputs

https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/cmp/

This is all a scheme to stop the used market from ruining their MSRP pricing.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#543

Post by throayobviousl »

creato wrote: post #497
akelly wrote: post #441

This won't really do anything for availability or reducing scalper pricing. Miners are a sizeable proportion of sales but far from the majority. Gamers will be able to buy more of these GPUs but less of the non-LHR or AMD GPU's. GPU prices won't actually change. The real reason Nvidia is doing this is that when mining profitability inevitably drops, either because of a crypto price crash or Ethereum moving to Proof o…

One of the issues people have mentioned in this thread is that cards sold by miners are often burnt out or nearly burnt out. In that case, it seems like cutting off miners from the secondary market would be an improvement for the secondary market.

While the cards are used heavily, thermal cycling arguably is worse than running a card 24/7. These cards do not generally experience any thermal fluctuations and were probably kept within adequate temps

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#544

Post by just-ok »

tshaddox wrote: post #375
just-ok wrote: post #331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the same way that a scientific theory was meaningless if it failed a test, a principle was meaningless if it needed to be adjusted when actually put to use.

Superseded scientific theories aren’t all “meaningless.” Newton’s laws of motion are superseded, but they aren’t meaningless, and you presumably wouldn’t say that scientists who updated their beliefs in the face of new evidence and explanations were doing anything wrong.

You’re right: “meaningless” was a heavy-handed attempt at continuing the parallel on my part. And sure, they weren’t doing anything wrong, but they fundamentally were wrong in the rules they followed previously. Similarly, if you adjust a principle, you admit that it didn’t hold for you in the first place.

As a tangent: while the parallel to scientific theories is good on the surface, it does lump in this idea that there’s a universal set of correct principles. Isn’t that just philosophy, then? Logical arguments about which principles are sound & universal. Maybe the lesson is to pick principles from the battle-tested ones rather than trying to develop your own.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#545

Post by kyboren »

SrslyJosh wrote: post #525
kyboren wrote: post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are not economic parasites. They are the physical manifestation of the Invisible Hand. These are people doing God's work making an efficient market. If you don't want arbitrageurs to capture that value, maybe NVidia should start pricing their products correctly so that they capture the value. This isn't rocket science. > If this has any effect on anybody who isn’t a crypto miner, it’s going to be to open up poss…

> Then they came for the cryptocurrency miners, and I did not speak out-- Because I deserve a subsidy for my video gaming habit. Are you suggesting that anyone who buys something and then doesn't use it to generate the maximum profit possible for themselves is being subsidized by someone else? That doesn't even remotely make sense. What's your stake in cryptocurrency?

Not at all. Simply: If the market value of an item is $2500, and I demand the ability to buy it at $750, I am demanding that someone, somewhere subsidizes my purchase.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#546

Post by akelly »

cle wrote: post #506
creato wrote: post #497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the issues people have mentioned in this thread is that cards sold by miners are often burnt out or nearly burnt out. In that case, it seems like cutting off miners from the secondary market would be an improvement for the secondary market.

I don't know much about GPUs and am curious how this "burn out" happens, do you have a link for those of us who'd like to read more about this?

There's three main ways GPUs wear out, silicon electromigration, electrolytic capacitor dryout, and fan bearing failure. And the first two happen much faster at higher temperatures. Temperatures are similar between gaming and mining, but miners run 24/7 compared to gaming 1-2 hrs/day, so the GPUs age like 10x faster. But still, GPU failures are pretty rare, I think the concern is overblown.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#547

Post by SilverRed »

op00to wrote: post #515
cle wrote: post #506

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know much about GPUs and am curious how this "burn out" happens, do you have a link for those of us who'd like to read more about this?

Too much heat causes flex and movement that can break solder traces, and makes it easier to let the magic smoke out.

Flex is caused when the temp changes. Mining cards stay at the same temp and don't move around a lot while overclocked gaming cards are getting flexed multiple times a day

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#548

Post by 8note »

wbraun wrote: post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

Is there any reason to sell GPUs for consumers to have in their computers anymore? The crypto folks seem more than happy to take all the GPUs at a premium, and consumers can use laptop integrated GPUs

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#549

Post by fomine3 »

TrainedMonkey wrote: post #540
Dylan16807 wrote: post #517

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Miners care enough about power efficiency and longevity; they don't run cards super hot.

Most scale oriented mining rigs I've seen pack cards super close together, even if you run them at reduced frequencies thermal environment is not great. See https://us.v-cdn.net/5021640/uploads/editor/do/j86gsm9cxvl2.... for example. Aside from a few top end models modern desktop GPUs are not designed for continuous operation at max load. When you combine than with higher temperature the lifespan of the cards is inde…

Latest Nvidia GPUs have large Tensor cores and RT cores but miners never use them. I wonder is it better for the situation.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#550

Post by 8note »

bouncycastle wrote: post #325
wbraun wrote: post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

GPUs by definition are not general purpose computers. Remember the G in GPU stands for Graphics, not General.

Doesn't the G in GPU stand for Crypto now?
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