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Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

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Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#111

Post by orky56 »

Kranar wrote: post #31
jti107 wrote: post #17

interesting philosophical question that intersects with "right to repair" and "ownership of digital purchases". when you buy a product does the company get to dictate what you can do with it.

When you buy a product? No. When you purchase a license agreement for software that the product depends on? Yes.

It's not quite so clear cut. Less and less hardware solutions can meaningfully exist without some software for it to provide the functions it was meant for when purchased. This is a slippery slope that brings together the right to repair & net neutrality law type arguments.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#112

Post by Keyframe »

wbraun wrote: post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

I'd be worried a lot if it were for existing products, but this is a right move in my opinion. Drastic times, drastic measures.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#113

Post by kevingadd »

NazakiAid wrote: post #56

A major bad point with this is when the mining cards become obsolete, they won't be able to be used as a graphics card in a computer due to it not being able to output to a display. So realistically it will decrease avaliable graphic card supply to gamers in the future who are maybe looking for a cheap used graphics card (therefore pushing people to buy a new card instead). Short term fix, long term problem. I was th…

NV sells tons of cards used for things other than mining and video output already. The mining cards can be repurposed for those use cases (compute, machine learning, etc)

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#114

Post by eugeniub »

wbraun wrote: post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

No I don't care.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#115

Post by tshaddox »

Siira wrote: post #85
tshaddox wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don’t these hardware manufacturers already deliberately reduce the performance of some chips just so they can sell them for cheaper without actually developing and manufacturing an additional line of chips (i.e. price discrimination)? This doesn’t seem much different.

Price discrimination is evil. Perfect discrimination leads to products having zero economic worth to the consumer.

It’s easy to think of it that way. But here’s another way to think about it: a manufacturer has two assembly lines for two different products which are sold at two price points. As they scale up production, they realize that they could realize significant economies of scale if they combine their assembly lines and only produce the more expensive product, but then apply an “artificial” limitation to half of those products so they can still sell to both markets. Is it somehow wrong for them to offer the same two product lines to the same two markets, but just with a more efficient manufacturing process?

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#116

Post by akersten »

wbraun wrote: post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

Yep, this enrages me. Deliberately introducing faults into a product to make it less appealing to one market segment in a desperate attempt to cover for their supply chain failure. Stinks to high heaven.

In addition the detection is not magic (it can't be) so there are going to be false positives. Can't wait until my games start dropping frames 30 minutes in because the driver decided my competitive FPS was actually mining crypto.

Imagine a headline like "Charmin introduces toilet paper that cannot be hoarded, to prevent shortages," and it's because the TP biodegrades after 6 months.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#117

Post by JamesSwift »

wbraun wrote: post #2

Does this behavior anger anyone else on a deep level? I get that its hard to buy GPUs right now, but this seems like such an attack on general purpose computing. Hardware manufactures already segment features between consumer and busness grade parts that the silicon itself is capable of, such as virtualization, but restricting what algorithms one can run is a whole new level. I am pretty sure my next GPU is going to…

I see no problem with it. I could see the argument that crypto is an existential threat to Nvidias business. If they lose a generation of PC gamers they risk that loss compounding years down the road as they and their children lean toward console. If they _want_ to serve those PC gamers first over crypto then they need to find ways to keep them as their customers.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#119

Post by oh_sigh »

Zenst wrote: post #32

I find the prospect of being able to add more overhead and potential bugs into a product to remove a niche functionality in a move that reeks of PR marketing driven solution, too be of bad taste. Whilst the overhead will be so small I doubt it will be measurable, it still is not zero and only adds the possibility that some workloads of non crypto currency origins fall foul of this in ways that may not be easy to disc…

"Niche functionality" that is ballooning the price of their graphics cards for end users?

> adds the possibility that some workloads of non crypto currency origins fall foul of this in ways that may not be easy to discern.

So what? The proof is in the pudding. You buy things as they are sold, not with some kind of expectation that you can achieve 100% of the theoretical performance of some ideal version of the product. If I buy a car with a limiter that doesn't let me go over 100mph, I shouldn't be surprised or upset that I can't hit 105 mph.

Re: Nvidia cripples cryptocurrency mining on RTX 3080 and 3070 cards

#120

Post by kevingadd »

moogly wrote: post #68

Why only reduce them to half the performance? How about 0%. I predict this will do absolutely nothing for general availability of these cards.

Denting the performance that way makes them no longer cost effective for eth, but doesn't make them completely useless for any workloads (in games, or adobe premiere, etc) that happen to look like crypto mining - so they can avoid selling a completely broken card.
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