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Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

blog.ethereum.org

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Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#81

Post by bsedlm »

kemonocode wrote: post #43

For the people who criticize as to why they've taken so long in shifting to a PoS model: consensus takes time, so does developing and testing something that definitively shouldn't go wrong. Also, there's the inherent issue with Proof-of-Stake that Proof-of-Work doesn't have: the initial distribution of the coin has to be wide enough before it could feasibly self-maintain a PoS shift without being immediately vulnerab…

> the initial distribution of the coin has to be wide enough

I don't understand how proof of stake works to the depth I understand proof of work. But this reassures me that it's feasable that they'll accomplish the same distributed consensus.

So then, could I say that Ethereum proof of stake will allow the owners of the coins (ether) to be independent from the owners of the mining operations?

or uhmm...

is the independence between the computaional costs of the "mining" and actual minted ether?

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#82

Post by Ericson2314 »

KptMarchewa wrote: post #52
michael_vo wrote: post #32

What are the attack vectors on PoS. With PoW you need 51% of the mining power to take over the system, which is very labor intensive to set up. With PoS could you take over all coins by buying 51% of the existing coins? So if the market cap of ETH is 200BB spend 100BB to double your money?

>So if the market cap of ETH is 200BB spend 100BB to double your money? No one would buy those from you, so at best you can burn money to burn other people's money at a premium.

The https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldfinger_(film) strategy, way less efficiently.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#83

Post by kodah »

h4kor wrote: post #13

> Several teams of engineers are working overtime to ensure that The Merge arrives as soon as possible, and without compromising on safety. Overworking your engineers will most definitely lead to compromises. But good to see that Ethereum came to their senses and are serious about reducing the environmental impact they have.

> But good to see that Ethereum came to their senses and are serious about reducing the environmental impact they have.

Is it not possible there's good reasons they didn't move to proof of stake sooner? "Came to their senses" seems to imply they had no good reasons.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#84

Post by TechBro8615 »

I was fairly into the space in 2014-2016 but stopped paying attention the last few years. It seems like lots of theorized applications actually exist and have a proof-of-concept now.

If I’m building a marketplace business in 2021, where I want to be “crypto-first” instead of relying on PayPal and Stripe Connect, where do I start?

The marketplace sells access to resources with an off-chain ACL system. It facilitates trades between resource sellers and buyers.

I assume I want a smart contract between buyer/seller to record resource grants on chain, which the access layer checks as a source of truth.

But if I were to do this on Ethereum, the gas fees would be really expensive. I’ve heard about Polygon and “optimistic roll-up.” Is this a viable solution?

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#85

Post by znite »

roel_v wrote: post #75

Maybe this is a good time and place to ask - let's say I want to buy something using Ethereum. Is it correct that when I look at, say, https://ycharts.com/indicators/ethereum_average_transaction_... , you have to pay USD 20 just as payment fees? I wrote off Bitcoin as a payment mechanism a long time ago because of this (although it seems BTC tx costs are now lower than ETH?), is this the direction tx costs for all cr…

Not sure how it all works, but I assume it's broken down for a purchase on something like Coinbase card - eg. they bundle a load of card transactions into a ETH to fiat conversion for Visa

https://help.coinbase.com/en/coinbase/trading-and-funding/ot...

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#86

Post by Vanclief »

focom wrote: post #2

So with PoS, we recreate a system where a few rich pool have decision over the network. Can someone enlighten me on how this is different from the current fiat system?

It is a system where you have skin in the game, the more skin in the game you have, the more power you have. Think it like a democracy where you are voting with your wallet.

The main difference with the fiat world is that with Ethereum you have transparency, and there is no corruption. You can't just bribe a politician to enact a rule you want. Everything that happens in the network is recorded permanently, and rules are not a suggestion, but a practical reality that can't be circumvented.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#87

Post by zepto »

tphyahoo2 wrote: post #71

https://github.com/libbitcoin/libbitcoin-system/wiki/Proof-o... https://standardcrypto.wordpress.com/2021/03/31/the-censorsh... ETH is competing against USD, not against BTC. Bitcoin is competing against gold. Different races. different goals. Different risks.

> ETH is competing against USD, not against BTC. Bitcoin is competing against gold.

If true, this means that every argument comparing BTC to fiat is bullshit.

Given that most arguments I see in favor of BTC compare it to fiat, this doesn’t speak well to the understanding of those who hold it.

Given that BTC’s value is predicated purely on the beliefs of those who hold it, a systematic misunderstanding like this suggests problems in store.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#88

Post by zionic »

focom wrote: post #2

So with PoS, we recreate a system where a few rich pool have decision over the network. Can someone enlighten me on how this is different from the current fiat system?

PoS is more equitable than endgame PoW. With PoS anyone with any amount of capital can secure the network. Even $10 can via decentralized stake pools.

With endgame PoW only the rich can acquire mining ASICs and locate them in cheap/free (stolen) electricity zones. The vast majority of the world is entirely excluded from PoW mining BTC because the cost of electricity in their region makes mining unprofitable.

Re: Ethereum will use around 99.95% less energy post merge

#90

Post by surmoi »

roel_v wrote: post #75

Maybe this is a good time and place to ask - let's say I want to buy something using Ethereum. Is it correct that when I look at, say, https://ycharts.com/indicators/ethereum_average_transaction_... , you have to pay USD 20 just as payment fees? I wrote off Bitcoin as a payment mechanism a long time ago because of this (although it seems BTC tx costs are now lower than ETH?), is this the direction tx costs for all cr…

Yes ETH gas price (transaction fee) have been very high, much higher than BTC lately...

Not all cryptocurrency have such insane transaction fees though. NANO is a good example of a fee-less cryptocurrency (cf. https://nano.org/)

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