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Vegan cheese has quietly but steadily infiltrated mainstream supermarket shelves

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Re: Vegan cheese has quietly but steadily infiltrated mainstream supermarket shelves

#351

Post by cheese_goddess »

tpoacher wrote: post #305
cheese_goddess wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Well, admittedly, I'm thinking in my native language, which is Greek, and where "almond milk" was basically milk mixed in with "Soumada" [1]. "Αμυγδαλόγαλα"; I confess I've never heard that word but maybe it's just an old word?

In Greek you don't tend to say that, you'd say Γάλα Αμύγδαλο instead (similarly Γάλα Σοκολάτα for chocolate milk, and Γάλα Τριαντάφυλλο for rose milk).

Ah, I see. Γάλα σοκολάτα, I know. I hadn't heard of the others but they make sense in that way.

Re: Vegan cheese has quietly but steadily infiltrated mainstream supermarket shelves

#352

Post by h0l0cube »

cheese_goddess wrote: post #257

>> A coagulant is typically added to turn the milk proteins into solid curds — in many cheeses, that coagulant is an enzyme called rennet, which is traditionally taken from an unweaned calf’s stomach lining, although vegetarian rennet, derived from molds or plants, is used in some cases. "Traditionally" rennet was taken from an unweaned milk animal's stomach (not just a calf's stomach. Some people make most of their…

> everytime I read an article about vegan cheese it seems to lead with the outdated information that rennet is, like, normally, made with the stomach lininig of unweaned calves

From the article:

> What Perfect Day is doing isn’t new, exactly: Pandya, who is vegan, points out that for a long time, dairy cheese wasn’t even considered vegetarian because of its use of rennet. When vegetarian rennet was developed in the 1970s and commercialized in the 1980s, “it wasn’t done for any profitability reason or consumer trend reason or anything to do with animal welfare,” Pandya says. “It was just economics — like, it just made more sense to use the latest in fermentation and biotechnology to figure out a way to make that enzyme without the extraction from an animal.

Re: Vegan cheese has quietly but steadily infiltrated mainstream supermarket shelves

#353

Post by h0l0cube »

pmoriarty wrote: post #78

Is there a good vegan substitute for hard, sharp cheddar cheese, or for blue cheese or gorgonzola? I've never seen anything that comes even remotely close.

From the article:

> Given McAthy’s expertise and scholarship on the subject, it’s not surprising that Blue Heron has been producing the vegan cheese world’s most dairy-esque products since 2016: its dried herb- and wine-powdered rounds look nearly indistinguishable on a cheese board from dairy. But that’s not actually McAthy’s intention.

> “My personal goal has always been that I really want to try to create or expand the boundaries of cheese-making, period,” she says. “So that means I’m happy to use the analogous term that people have a reference point for” — some of her cheeses resemble blues and Camembert — “but I’m just trying to create new cheeses.” This brings up the question of what cheese really is, exactly, and what vegan cheesemakers might be proving is that it’s simply fermented milk. Could be cow’s or goat’s milk, or it could be cashew.

The article talks a lot about artisanal cheese makers applying traditional dairy processes to nut-based cheeses

Re: Vegan cheese has quietly but steadily infiltrated mainstream supermarket shelves

#354

Post by GuB-42 »

anigbrowl wrote: post #66
autarch wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's something unexpected about this aspect of veganism, which is often embraced by those wanting to lead a healthier lifestyle ... I'm not sure what you base this statement on. There are many people whose initial motivations for going vegan were ethical, either to avoid funding animal abuse, environmental degradation, or both. That was why I went vegan 23.5 years ago, and why I'm still vegan. I eat mock meat an…

I totally get ethical vegetarianism, and appreciate that much animal abuse can occur within the dairy industry, but I don't think that's inherent. Of course, believing that and shopping ethically requires a great deal more selectivity and research (and willingness to pay more for food whose provenance can be trusted). Not to pick a fight, but I don't get the basic argument that 'all animal husbandry = unnatural explo…

Milk production involves separating calves from their mothers on a yearly basis. Most are slaughtered shortly after, their stomach lining is taken as it contains an enzyme used for cheese production.

Personally, I am fine with it as long as no extra, unnecessary suffering is caused, but some activists may call it inherent animal abuse.

Re: Vegan cheese has quietly but steadily infiltrated mainstream supermarket shelves

#355

Post by pezezin »

ENIanDEM wrote: post #287
CobsterLock wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you! I'll have to try this. weird that it uses a less chili powder than I usually use in my meat chili (roughly 3 tbs for 2lbs of meat and a can of beans). Maybe I'm just used to a ton more spice. I could have been amping it up after going away from red meat

That could be because the chili molecule has polarity and clumps together in fatty environments, like meat sauces and yoghurt. Conversely it gets dispersed by water. That recipe probably has a bit less fat than what your usual meaty one has, so less chili goes further :)

It's actually the other way around: capsaicin is non-polar, that's why it is hydrophobic but soluble in oil and fat.

Re: Vegan cheese has quietly but steadily infiltrated mainstream supermarket shelves

#356

Post by celtain »

barbazoo wrote: post #106
Accacin wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm vegan, and probably not. I've heard that most vegan substitutes are processed heavily so not really more healthy (and probably less healthy than non-vegan options). However, I do still eat them on occasion. Sometimes after a 30km run, all I think about is burgers so when I get home and sit and have vegan burger with vegan cheese. It may not be as good as the 'real thing' but it hits the spot :)

After 2 years or so of eating vegetarian I don't think that meat burgers are actually better. First of all, a burger is all about toppings and condiments. And vegetarian patties have come such a long way, texture and flavor wise, it blows my mind. Compared to the boring and ever the same taste of meat it doesn't even come close for me.

My standard workday lunch used to be a chicken salad sandwich with all the toppings. When I replaced that with a mushroom melt I realized I didn't actually care that much about the chicken itself.

A lot of the meat I was consuming was just a matter of treating meat as the default option, not because it was actually adding significant value. That style of eating comprised at least 75%-90% of my meat consumption, and cutting that out turned out to be extremely easy.

The last 10%-25% has been much harder though, especially when my wife and most of my friends like eating meat so much.

Re: Vegan cheese has quietly but steadily infiltrated mainstream supermarket shelves

#357

Post by bromley »

cheese_goddess wrote: post #342
bromley wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's one: because you love cheese but you also love animals and so don't want to contribute to their suffering. In my experience people tend to become vegan: 1. for the animals; and/or 2. for the planet; and/or 3. for health. I have never heard another vegan say they became vegan because they didn't like the taste of cheese.

I have. Rather, the vegan I know didn't like the taste of meat. But of course what I said had nothing to do with being vegan because you don't like the taste of cheese. What I said was, if you like the taste of meat and cheese so much so that you can't do without a substitute of it, then why are you vegan? If you are vegan, for good ethical or environmental reasons, then why do you need to eat pretend-meat and preten…

Well I must say that sounds like some peculiar logic to me! But hey, I spent years performing mental gymnastics to justify the suffering I contributed to by eating meat and dairy, so I can see where you are coming from ;)

I used to love steak, and fish, and various other non-vegan things. But I became increasingly uncomfortable with the thought of where those things came from, and eventually I had to give them up. I couldn't live with myself if I didn't. Having vegan substitutes just made it easier. I don't see the harm in that, neither do I see the hypocracy. I want the taste, but I don't want the suffering.

Re: Vegan cheese has quietly but steadily infiltrated mainstream supermarket shelves

#358

Post by adrusi »

the-alchemist wrote: post #238
subculture wrote: post #136

There's certainly a trope of "...but I can't give up cheese" and as someone who went from vegetarian to vegan: Yeah, cheese is hard to replicate. But also: your body and tastes adapt. After a few weeks off of dairy our memories of those old textures and mouth feel start to fade and are replaced. Humans don't like changes in patterns, but at the same time are relatively quick to adapt to new ones. There's real addicti…

Yeah, I've found moving to new foods to be relatively painless if done incrementally. Took just two weeks to convert my toddler son from cow's milk to soy milk (Silk brand, for the curious). First day, it was 90% / 10% dairy/cow. Second day, it was (eyeballing) 85% / 15% dairy/cow. You get the idea... Didn't even notice the transition.

A note for anyone coming across this: soy milk is nutritionally comparable to cow's milk, but other milk alternative are not. Children who receive much of their nutrition from milk should not transition directly to almond or oat milk without considering other parts of their diet as well.

Re: Vegan cheese has quietly but steadily infiltrated mainstream supermarket shelves

#359

Post by balls187 »

cheese_goddess wrote: post #343
balls187 wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here is another: you love cheese and are allergic to casein. Not me, but the gal I am dating is allergic to dairy, and so we had some fun finding vegan cheeses that did not have casein. It was nice to make a dish that typically has cheese, that we both could enjoy.

Allergic to casein and any animal matter besides? Your friend can't eat meat?

She enjoys meat just fine. It's just milk proteins she is allergic too, and it's not an intolerance.

Re: Vegan cheese has quietly but steadily infiltrated mainstream supermarket shelves

#360

Post by anyfoo »

js2 wrote: post #81
derbOac wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So my wife and I are vegetarian and I love certain vegan cheese, the naturally cultured ones where you essentially have a plant product that is cultured with cheese bacteria. My experience with this stuff is similar to a lot of things in vegetarian diet, which is that the problems come about when you start trying to create imitations of animal products. I do not want to suggest that people "just don't like vegan chee…

I tend to agree with this. I'm not a vegetarian, but if I were, I'd wouldn't eat imitation animal products anymore than I'd drink non-alcoholic beer. I'm happy to eat vegetarian food. It stands on its own as delicious. One of the best "burgers" I've ever had was made with black beans and wasn't trying to imitate meat. (It was at The Vortex in Atlanta years ago.) Imitation products that I've tried have always just lef…

> anymore than I'd drink non-alcoholic beer.

Non-alcoholic beer seems more popular in Germany (yes, Germany, where beer is very serious business) than in the US.

I like it a lot, because it's a refreshing drink with good taste and no alcohol, well suitable if you want to drive or just don't feel like drinking alcohol right now.

I wish it was more common in the US (where I live now).

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