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Stranded sailor allowed to leave abandoned ship after four years

bbc.com

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Re: Stranded sailor allowed to leave abandoned ship after four years

#211

Post by yerwhat01010 »

aidenn0 wrote: post #200
justinator wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Downvote me all you want it's not not true. Rich people don't exist without exploiting the poor; so too with countries. I'm not sorry if you're wealthy and this is hurting too close to home, better live with it if you also want to be so wealthy.

The wealthy exploiting the poor predates capitalism by 10s of thousands of years.

I'd also say that the relationship between the average 10th-centry peasant and his feudal lord strikes me as a lot less "exploitative" than the typical employee-employer relationship today.

Re: Stranded sailor allowed to leave abandoned ship after four years

#212

Post by INTPenis »

NullPrefix wrote: post #168
INTPenis wrote: post #42

I don't understand what use he was on that ship? And can't they find any out of work person from shore to take his place? I'm sure there are dozens lining up to get that job for a few pennies an hour. And they might just have family in the area that can help sustain them.

You seem to assume that Aisha was paid for those 4 years. I assume otherwise too, but I did not saw any contradicting evidence.

The article says he wasn't paid, at least part of the time. But what I'm saying is that this whole practice makes no sense. There must be people on shore who would be willing to be custodians of abandoned ships.

That's a business idea, start an office offering ship custodians for shipping companies. When they get in trouble they can hire your custodian instead of stranding one of their own employees far from home.

Re: Stranded sailor allowed to leave abandoned ship after four years

#213

Post by seneca »

kevmo wrote: post #135
jollybean wrote: post #130

Folks - this is what we are outsourcing and externalizing. When foreign entities are able to bid for a lot less, and pay a lot less, a lot of it has to do with the fact that they will not bother with 'end of life' for ships, or getting insurance, or worrying about the lives of people who are 'expendable'. Those very nice buildings in Dubai come from some nasty labour practices. If every piece of this puzzle from end-…

Nasty labour practices... It's just slavery. This poor gentleman was forced into slavery. You're right that this is what we're outsourcing. All of the corporate trade agreements - American manufacturing was shipped overseas, and American labor forced to compete with what is often a modern form of slave labor.

Words have meaning, and the meaning of "slavery" is not "a bad situation". Slavery is alive and well in the world, but this story has nothing to do with it.

Re: Stranded sailor allowed to leave abandoned ship after four years

#214

Post by worldsayshi »

nickff wrote: post #204
lolinder wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Egypt definitely has fault here, but the company that owns the ship could have gotten the ship out of there if they cared about him at all. Yes, it might have been expensive, but I would expect a US based company to have rescued him within weeks of this situation starting, not years.

The article says the parent company is in financial difficulties, and the individual in question was basically being held for ransom (along with the ship). Depending on the ordering of debts (for the company), they may not have been able to compensate the Egyptians. All of that being said, I agree an American company likely would have had this sorted out faster, because the USA tends to deal with bankruptcies and the…

Seems to me that corporations owning ships having financial difficulties would be a natural consequence of outsourcing behaviour. You want to outsource risk and responsibilities. So the big companies get rid of their ships and hire small companies on the edge of profitability.

I assume it's not always the most sound way to do business but some should get away with it.

Re: Stranded sailor allowed to leave abandoned ship after four years

#215

Post by Godel_unicode »

danielheath wrote: post #164
jfrunyon wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American manufacturing was shipped overseas because , i.e. after, American labor was unable to compete. I'm not sure what "corporate trade agreements" means either; corporations don't make "trade agreements". I'm also not sure why everyone takes for granted that America not having as many manufacturing jobs is a bad thing...

You mean paid labor couldn’t compete on price with slaves? Color me shocked.

Yes, but also the standard of living in the US that American labor can't really compete on price with anyone.

Re: Stranded sailor allowed to leave abandoned ship after four years

#216

Post by [deleted] »

water8 wrote: post #171
jfrunyon wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American manufacturing was shipped overseas because , i.e. after, American labor was unable to compete. I'm not sure what "corporate trade agreements" means either; corporations don't make "trade agreements". I'm also not sure why everyone takes for granted that America not having as many manufacturing jobs is a bad thing...

Manufacturing is like a ladder. When you outsource the bottom, it’s no different than cutting the rungs of a ladder beneath you. Manufacturing is essential to the wealth and prosperity of any nation.

[deleted]

Re: Stranded sailor allowed to leave abandoned ship after four years

#218

Post by quickthrowman »

justinator wrote: post #186
justinator wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Downvote me all you want it's not not true. Rich people don't exist without exploiting the poor; so too with countries. I'm not sorry if you're wealthy and this is hurting too close to home, better live with it if you also want to be so wealthy.

People with more resources have been exploiting people with less resources since probably the domestication of animals and plants created sedentary living and the idea of money/credit, perhaps before that even. Not just under capitalism, mind you, but every form of economic system.

I believe resource inequality will exist until free or near-free energy sources are developed, and even then, you still need ever expanding amounts of land/space. I believe it’s a consequence of scarcity and human nature.

Re: Stranded sailor allowed to leave abandoned ship after four years

#219

Post by chiph »

busterarm wrote: post #183
JJMcJ wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Read a story of a ship's captain, stuck on the ship at anchor in New Jersey. There is a mariner's charity in Greater New York that would help out. They would post a bond with ICE and drive the sailor to an airport or another ship. Well, whether 9/11 security or what, they weren't allowed to do this. So the captain had been on the ship for over a year. So, yes, it can happen here.

Sounds interesting. Got a link?

It happens fairly frequently. The owner runs into financial difficulty and the creditors seize the ship. The crew can't leave because they aren't allowed to abandon it, as well as not having a visa to enter the US to get to the airport, nor the money for airfare home.

The locals usually donate food & supplies to the crew.

https://www.charlestoncitypaper.com/story/how-a-charleston-p...

Re: Stranded sailor allowed to leave abandoned ship after four years

#220

Post by axiosgunnar »

devcpp wrote: post #155
jandrese wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think his job was basically security guard for the property. Also, if the ship were to come unmoored and collide with another vessel they would need someone to blame.

But why can't he quit? If the owning company didn't assign another guard that's their fault, not the guard. Imagine if a chauffeur was forever assigned to a car because it broke on a disabled parking place. It would just get towed and the bill or court order sent to the actual owner and the chauffeur can quit. 100% blame on Egypt here for a stupid rule ignoring consequences.

Mentally imagining the situation you described with a chauffeur is hilarious - which only underlines the absurdity of this poor guy's situation.
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