Wildtype: Sushi-grade salmon grown from Pacific Salmon cells • Hacker News Board

Re: Wildtype: Sushi-grade salmon grown from Pacific Salmon cells

#101

Post by toiletfuneral » Thu, Apr 22, 2021, 7:05 PM UTC

andrewla wrote: post #94

This movement towards synthetic meat seems very antithetical to the natural foods heuristic. Isn't what we've learned over the last half-century or so that processing food in an attempt to make it more nutritious/uniform/etc. generally involves a reductive analysis of the value of the food and in doing so destroys most of the actual nutrient value? The "shopping at the edges of the market" thing is a tolerably good h…

Wait till you find out how unnatural most meat is. Its totally full or hormones and ammonia...And just to get ahead of the inevitable response, no, the vast majority of consumers do not buy grass fed / free range / whatever. Its a dodge and impossible to scale to current consumption levels based on land availability.

Re: Wildtype: Sushi-grade salmon grown from Pacific Salmon cells

#102

Post by saxonww » Thu, Apr 22, 2021, 7:07 PM UTC

WillPostForFood wrote: post #67

vessenes wrote: post #13

Boy I really wish I knew more about the science here. I can't tell if it's yucky, so they don't discuss it, or if it's vapor, so they don't discuss it. That said, their photo looks like something I would at least taste! Matrix-grown meat seems to me like something that will have its place in the world, especially if the net environmental impact is favorable. So, Wild Type: more details, yo.

The photo on their website looks amazing, with perfect fatty stripes. Photos from one of their early tastings in 2019 didn't look so good. Mostly chopped up, and larger pieces didn't seem to have the fatty layers. https://i0.wp.com/thespoon.tech/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/w... It makes me question if the salmon in the photos on their website is really lab grown. If so, it is quite an achievement.

I had a different reaction on seeing it.

Yes, it has the striped pattern, but the texture looks completely wrong. Compare their image now with e.g. https://i.redd.it/12cdw2wb55p01.jpg. It's superficially similar; the 'early tasting' picture you link to looks _better_ from a texture perspective, to me.

That doesn't mean it's not tasty, but I would not choose this over the real thing (traditional preparation? idk).

Re: Wildtype: Sushi-grade salmon grown from Pacific Salmon cells

#103

Post by ska » Thu, Apr 22, 2021, 7:08 PM UTC

f430 wrote: post #6

looks like another Beyond Meat style pump & dump

> another Beyond Meat style pump & dump

Whatever Beyond Meat is, "pump & dump" is off base. They may fail in their ambition but the attempt is real.

Re: Wildtype: Sushi-grade salmon grown from Pacific Salmon cells

#104

Post by Daishiman » Thu, Apr 22, 2021, 7:08 PM UTC

andrewla wrote: post #94

This movement towards synthetic meat seems very antithetical to the natural foods heuristic. Isn't what we've learned over the last half-century or so that processing food in an attempt to make it more nutritious/uniform/etc. generally involves a reductive analysis of the value of the food and in doing so destroys most of the actual nutrient value? The "shopping at the edges of the market" thing is a tolerably good h…

It isn't really "heavily processed" any more than artificicially selecting seeds for edible plants and growing them through aquaponics or other "unnatural" settings.

Lab-grown meat implies that most of the basic cell chemistry of these cells is going to occur as usual. To me that kills many of the stronger arguments against processed food.

Re: Wildtype: Sushi-grade salmon grown from Pacific Salmon cells

#105

Post by jraph » Thu, Apr 22, 2021, 7:09 PM UTC

ianai wrote: post #99

andrewla wrote: post #94

This movement towards synthetic meat seems very antithetical to the natural foods heuristic. Isn't what we've learned over the last half-century or so that processing food in an attempt to make it more nutritious/uniform/etc. generally involves a reductive analysis of the value of the food and in doing so destroys most of the actual nutrient value? The "shopping at the edges of the market" thing is a tolerably good h…

It’s at least more efficient and doesn’t result in killing animals. This is probably way more sparing of water use, for instance. Whether someone wants more nutritious food or not is a secondary concern from decoupling meat consumption from current (horrible) practices.

Exactly. I see the benefit of this kind of food even if it is somewhat weak nutritionally if used occasionally in an otherwise well balanced diet. Sure, don't do this for every meal, but maybe don't it with regular sushi neither anyway. Enjoy your occasional sushi without the ethical / environmental drawbacks of eating actual salmon, and remain healthy by diversifying food.

I'd be glad too, actually.

Re: Wildtype: Sushi-grade salmon grown from Pacific Salmon cells

#106

Post by kleton » Thu, Apr 22, 2021, 7:10 PM UTC

Why wouldn't you do tuna in a vat instead? Higher value fish, and the culture requirements would be nearly identical.

Re: Wildtype: Sushi-grade salmon grown from Pacific Salmon cells

#107

Post by Daishiman » Thu, Apr 22, 2021, 7:12 PM UTC

raldi wrote: post #87

What I'm looking forward to is lab-grown meat that improves upon nature. Imagine pigs didn't exist but someone figured out how to make bacon in the lab. What do we not have on this Earth that makes bacon seem like chicken breast? What might we invent that's three levels past otoro?

Give it a decade and we'll be taking this to a level of customization where we'll be able to select our own level of marbling, connective tissue and water content.

Re: Wildtype: Sushi-grade salmon grown from Pacific Salmon cells

#108

Post by Daishiman » Thu, Apr 22, 2021, 7:13 PM UTC

WillPostForFood wrote: post #70

jtolmar wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Widespread adoption of this technology would likely lead to more total salmon lives, as wild populations recover.

This seems non-obvious. How many salmon are farmed vs wild right now? Salmon is already protected and very expensive, so what's the potential for increase in wild population? 2x? 10x? And there would still be demand for "the real thing".

Farmed salmon incurs a heavy cost to the environment that surrounds said farms.

Demand for real salmon will still be around but it will be a rare delicacy, which is totally OK.

Re: Wildtype: Sushi-grade salmon grown from Pacific Salmon cells

#109

Post by Plough_Jogger » Thu, Apr 22, 2021, 7:13 PM UTC

jimbokun wrote: post #62

tymekpavel wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See the comments below - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26905472 ~$200 for a 6-piece sushi roll.

Is there hope for some kind of law for the price steadily decreasing over time as efficiencies improve, like Moore's law for computer chips or the exponential increase of solar efficiency?

Yes, see Wright's Law: https://ark-invest.com/wrights-law/

Re: Wildtype: Sushi-grade salmon grown from Pacific Salmon cells

#110

Post by weaksauce » Thu, Apr 22, 2021, 7:17 PM UTC

iamwil wrote: post #76

As a curiosity and side note, Salmon wasn't always eaten by the Japanese as sushi. It was considered a garbage fish that you'd grill due to its likelihood of being infected by parasites. It was the Norwegians that had a surplus, and was looking for a new market to open up that salmon sushi became a thing. https://medium.com/torodex/salmon-sushi-is-not-a-japanese-in... The Norwegians probably won't pay attention to th…

Andong did a deep dive on it and the norway genesis isn't the full story: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1k4x9FrD5k4