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Thanks for the Bonus, I Quit

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Re: Thanks for the Bonus, I Quit

#361

Post by jraby3 »

danieltillett wrote: post #221
projectileboy wrote: post #77

The asymmetry between how employees agonize over their behavior towards their employers vs how employers think of their employees never ceases to amaze me. Never forget that your employer will gleefully lay off their most loyal employees if doing so is somehow in alignment with some executive’s comp. I’m not saying you should ever behave unethically, I’m just saying that if you’re on the field, you should be aware of…

Many employers agonise over laying off employees, I would go so far as to say the vast majority do. Many employers try to keep on employees in situations where they really should be laid off, putting their own jobs at risk. Don’t get into the the mindset that employers are all psychopaths - not only is it not true, but it will damage your career thinking this way.

Thank you for saying this. It’s frustrating to see all the hate against employers. It really depends on the company and people you work with, and that can be said for both the employee and employer.

Re: Thanks for the Bonus, I Quit

#362

Post by [deleted] »

EdwinLarkin wrote: post #358
foobazzy wrote: post #353

At a certain multinational company that Anon(a close friend) is currently employed at had this way of distributing bonuses when the pandemic hit. Context: the company is chasing a $100mn y-o-y growth at this point. - All employees in the US offices get a hefty bonus for the profits they contributed to - All employees in the India office were to not receive bonuses/increments because we wanted to cut costs (not to for…

That's completely normal and does not only apply to India but all other offshore centers like Eastern Europe or the Philippines. You guys are a cost centre.

[deleted]

Re: Thanks for the Bonus, I Quit

#364

Post by intricatedetail »

I don't get the idea of bonuses. If employer wants people to do more work, they should just pay more. I'd never work under "if you achieve X you'll get Y". Too many times I found it to be a manipulation or just a scam to get more work for free. Not worth the mental health damage.

Re: Thanks for the Bonus, I Quit

#365

Post by inglor_cz »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #209

I knew a guy who put his two weeks notice in just before the annual Christmas bonus came out. So they stiffed him on the bonus. They ended up paying for that in spades. This was in the planning field and he was moving from a private consulting firm to a government job. Government is where the real power is for this industry. If they were one minute late "Sorry, we are closed/you missed the deadline." If they had any…

This is a moral conflict if I ever saw one. Assuming that the guy was a pedant only against his former company and not everyone around.

On one hand, a sleazy company gets karma-whipped.

On the other hand, the overall harm from a public authority enforcing the law unevenly because of a personal grudge is not negligible either. Junior people working with him will normalize this behavior and repeat it.

Neutral public institutions are a great achievement that helps the entire society grow.

Re: Thanks for the Bonus, I Quit

#366

Post by onemiketwelve »

faeyanpiraat wrote: post #314
laurent92 wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve worked for a startup who was giving 866 stock options per month. Had I known they are valued $125 today, I would have: - Shut up a few more times because I’d trust more the managers, and just followed the stream, - Accepted to be patient about being a developer on a boring project, because what stressed me was “I don’t know enough to reach the career level that can allow me to ever buy a house.” - Made 4 million…

You really shouldn’t feel bad, because what happened has a low probability. It’s like saying I should’ve invested in X which got quadrupled in price last year. Most stocks (even very promising ones) didn’t achieve anywhere near that growth. So you choosing the right one among the many to “shut up and stick to it just a little bit longer” has a low chance of exceptional returns on your investment. You cannot see the f…

Exactly. This is like being dealt a horrible set of cards in poker and kicking yourself for folding. Let's say you got 2,7 and then found out the cards on the table turned out to be the rest of the 2s. Folding was still the right move

Re: Thanks for the Bonus, I Quit

#367

Post by rualca »

barry-cotter wrote: post #287
dmarlow wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Overwork sucks but if you have evidence that it’s bad for productivity please cite it. Seriously? Of all things, something so obvious like this needs needs citation?

Feel free to name any category of professional where working over 40 hours a week isn’t quite normal. Doctors, lawyers, engineers, professors. It sure looks like people who work more than 40 hours a week on average do better than those who don’t. This is not a claim about what I wish was true, but about what actually seems to be true. The actual research on this is scarce to the point of non-existence. It may actuall…

> Feel free to name any category of professional where working over 40 hours a week isn’t quite normal.

YMMV but the only time I ever experienced the myth that "working over 40 hours a week is the norm" was when I started working at a US-based company.

And the only reason unpaid overtime was the norm was that managers, specially skip-level management, did a piss-poor job establishing sane goals based on realistic time-frames, and typically threatened to fire people pretty much each and every single week if they did not met those unrealistic goals.

Strangely enough, everywhere else people managed to do their job within the 40hours work week.

Re: Thanks for the Bonus, I Quit

#368

Post by thedrbrian »

chii wrote: post #267
taeric wrote: post #26

This is literally a plot point in Christmas Vacation. Is also why I think it is silly for startups to provide too many perks. It sets obvious precedent and will upset more folks when you stop. Find ways to invest in the company so that success is it's own perk. If the company truly has more, work that into raises where you clearly tie the income to the success of the company.

> success is it's own perk aka, equity compensation. Because i sure aint gonna consider it a perk if a CEO (or owners) to get richer, while i just get praise for making the success!

> Peter Gibbons: You see, Bob, it's not that I'm lazy, it's that I just don't even care.

>Bob Porter: Don't- don't care?

>Peter Gibbons: It's a problem of motivation, all right? Now if I work my ass off and Initech ships a few extra units, I don't see another dime, so where's the motivation?

Before I started working at MASSIVE CORP I thought Office Space was a comedy.....

Re: Thanks for the Bonus, I Quit

#369

Post by anticristi »

forgingahead wrote: post #254
ben0x539 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> my boss asks: what is to stop me threatening to resign every time I don’t get my way? Nothing. That's how negotiating an employment relationship works. Holy shit.

It's not. That is an independent contractor relationship. Employment means you play ball for the stability of the paycheck. If you want to throw a tantrum every time you feel slighted, you shouldn't commit to a full-time permanent job. Employees are not the top of the totem pole, there are always other factors that people making these decisions have to consider. They don't always have to share that with you. It's a n…

I allow my boss to be very demanding. Want me to take an important customer call during holidays? Sure, I can convince my wife to allow that. Want me to work a week in a different timezone? Let me check first, but should be doable.

But. Do. Not. Ever. Touch. My. Compensation!

Being promised 100% but arbitrarily receiving 30% would be a no-go for me.

Re: Thanks for the Bonus, I Quit

#370

Post by frereubu »

Dopamine reward signals in the brain are coded by how expected a reward is. Why? Because it's a learning signal. You've done something that you don't expect a reward for, but get one anyway? Hey, dopamine rush, I need to notice that positive outcome and learn what happened because it might work again. Conversely, if you do something that you're used to eliciting an expected reward and nothing happens, negative outcome, dopamine crash - I need to learn about this disappointment.

This post is a classic example (although there are other factors, such as the slowness of other teams who didn't know about the programme) - the people who weren't expecting a bonus were much happier with a much lower bonus. Add in the crappy way they hid the programme, so others didn't realise what was at stake and it was a recipe for disaster.

If a bonus is expected it's not a "bonus", and only sets up expectations that lead to huge disappointment when it eventually doesn't happen.

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