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Why the United States has the best research universities

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Re: Why the United States has the best research universities

#231

Post by chakhs »

rossdavidh wrote: post #117

So, the ascent of U.S. universities to high status on a worldwide scale, happened in the first half of the 20th century really. Why? Well, because Europe was tearing itself apart in two world wars, and the U.S. sat out the first half of both of those, while receiving a lot of talent fleeing those wars. If you have the money, and the former top-of-the-heap has bombed their wealth into rubble, it doesn't require any ma…

I would add to that control over top scientific journals. Before the war people used to publish scientific work in other languages, and in local journals. After the war the US took more control over published research. But it's also because of the money, and a good strategy ofc

Re: Why the United States has the best research universities

#233

Post by emteycz »

WalterBright wrote: post #195
fighterpilot wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But not a temperate climate over its whole geography or stable government structures over the last 200 years.

The USSR was stable for 70 years. Long enough. The problem was lack of free markets. Free markets are the common thread among successful economic powers. Not population, not resources, not rivers, etc.

Huh? I don't think there was a single moment of stability anywhere in the whole Eastern bloc (was born there). Especially not political stability, and much less economical. People and businesses were continually deliberately destroyed on massive scale the entire time.

Though yeah, free markets are key.

Re: Why the United States has the best research universities

#234

Post by rurban »

flohofwoe wrote: post #225
jhbadger wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Although the Soviets had a very similar system (Operation Osoaviakhim) to get German scientists after the war, although less well known (and also a bit less voluntary on the part of the scientists) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Osoaviakhim

The Soviet's didn't really know how to properly make use of "their" Germans though, at least for working on concrete projects. Only very few designs of German teams actually made it into production (like the turboprop engines used in the Tu-95: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupolev_Tu-95 ), but the Soviets never trusted their Germans enough to really integrate them longterm with Russian teams, instead the goal was to…

Easy to explain because the German fascists made a perfect match with the American fascists, whilst Russian communists had a problem with German fascists, plus under Stalin/Berisha everybody had a problem, also communist Germans and communist Russians. They nevertheless built up the Russian rocket and nuclear program.

In the US the germans could build the rocket program by their own without much US interference, until Lyndon Johnson broke it up.

Re: Why the United States has the best research universities

#235

Post by mncharity »

Aerroon wrote: post #200
cycomanic wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think like usual reality is more complex. The reason why America became such a economic powerhouse by the beginning of the 20th century was clearly the large scale immigration to a land that was generally considered the land of opportunities, without the crust of established economic structures in Europe. Someone from any social background could make it there. Due to this background there was a lot of aversion to "…

> It's somewhat ironic that the US which was founded on escaping the large "unfair" inequalities of old Europe and a strong anti-establishment/anti-elite basis has since become a beacon of a new elite/establishment and inequality. It's probably one of those cyclical things in life. Your former greatness ends up becoming a burden that keeps growing. Eventually it'll become so heavy that things fall apart. From the ash…

US views on China repeatedly remind me of old-regime European commentary on a younger US.

Re: Why the United States has the best research universities

#236

Post by oneplane »

hackflip wrote: post #150
oneplane wrote: post #133

But does it matter if you have an extreme wealth gap, a culture of fear and violence, and a lot of people living in poverty? It's always nice to point out the things that are doing great according to some metrics, but when put in perspective, what does it end up doing for the people? It shouldn't mean that "unless it benefits blue collar workers it doesn't need to exist", but you'd expect tooting one's own national h…

Many cultures value sharing the pizza equally. American culture values making more, and bigger pizzas.

I suppose that's a good pizza-analogy, perhaps with an addition: ... values making more, and bigger pizzas, even if it means a lot of people get no pizza at all.

Re: Why the United States has the best research universities

#237

Post by oneplane »

R0b0t1 wrote: post #206
oneplane wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone from the EU, some of your points seem very true, but it's also simply a matter of many people not really having the same goals and requirements. There is no true independence in any society, apart from autocracy, and externalities always exist. There doesn't seem to be much value attributed to 'having a lot of money' etc, for a lot of people, having a fulfilling job, family and life is enough, and having t…

Your explanation fits into what he described, point 3 & 4. You're trying to justify why taking risks isn't required.

It doesn't need justification, but for outsiders it might need explanations.

There is no value in risk in itself.

Re: Why the United States has the best research universities

#238

Post by random314 »

WalterBright wrote: post #195
fighterpilot wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But not a temperate climate over its whole geography or stable government structures over the last 200 years.

The USSR was stable for 70 years. Long enough. The problem was lack of free markets. Free markets are the common thread among successful economic powers. Not population, not resources, not rivers, etc.

As well as colonialism and puppet governments in Latin America.

Re: Why the United States has the best research universities

#239

Post by deathtrader666 »

rossdavidh wrote: post #117

So, the ascent of U.S. universities to high status on a worldwide scale, happened in the first half of the 20th century really. Why? Well, because Europe was tearing itself apart in two world wars, and the U.S. sat out the first half of both of those, while receiving a lot of talent fleeing those wars. If you have the money, and the former top-of-the-heap has bombed their wealth into rubble, it doesn't require any ma…

Plus, the US is literally printing its own money with abandon.
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