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“My Octopus Teacher” defied convention

nautil.us

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Re: “My Octopus Teacher” defied convention

#41

Post by joshuaheard »

js2 wrote: post #27

I enjoyed reading this interview a lot. I appreciate the perspective and knowledge that Craig Foster offers into the ecosystem he is so familiar with. But with the documentary, it was the opposite. The cinematography is gorgeous and many of the scenes that were captured were truly remarkable because he spent so much time in the water. The footage of the octopus and the sharks was just extraordinary. However, I really…

The movie is not a nature documentary, it is a love story. He starts out making a nature documentary, but this is merely the context of his relationship with the octopus.

Re: “My Octopus Teacher” defied convention

#42

Post by m3ta4a »

js2 wrote: post #37
Avalaxy wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I really found the way Craig injected himself into the story to be a distraction and wish this had been more like Sir David Attenborough documentary Can you already see this 94 years old guy jumping into the water to build a personal relationship with an octopus? ;) I think the whole point of the movie was not capturing the life of the octopus, but showing the relationship between human and octopus. This would not…

Sure, but I didn't need to hear CF's life story. He could've presented the octopus and his interaction with it without all that. Almost everyone I've talked to found it to detract from the documentary.

I enjoyed his story, it provided background without which it would have been footage of an octopus like every other nature documentary.

Re: “My Octopus Teacher” defied convention

#43

Post by Falling3 »

gregshap wrote: post #33
Avalaxy wrote: post #8

> The only thing to add to that, where you have to be slightly careful, is if an animal hasn’t got strong genes. And then you interfere and you allow that animal to procreate. You could potentially be making the gene pool weaker and more susceptible to mange. That’s where you have to be a bit careful. It's interesting that we can talk about this in such an objective and rational way when it involves non-human animal…

Also frowned upon when done to humans, but accepted by most humans in regard to animals: slavery, raising for food, taxidermy, hunting for sport, neutering and keeping as pets, etc. Some people don't think this treatment is appropriate for non-human animals either. Personally I eat other animals, but I'm against both eugenics and cannibalism.

The problem is most people do not have a rational basis for the differences in the behaviors you outlined. The reasoning generally rests completely on logical fallacies.

Re: “My Octopus Teacher” defied convention

#44

Post by SideburnsOfDoom »

BEEdwards wrote: post #22

I did not like this documentary at all, i don't get the point of it at all... A privileged white dude complains about how he feels disconnected from his family, so he spends a year harassing an octopus. It literally tries to run away and he stalks it, it's creepy.

> It literally tries to run away and he stalks it, it's creepy.

shrug other people who dive in that bay would stalk it, catch it, kill it and later that day; cook and serve it with some nice white wine to their family. Is that less creepy?

Re: “My Octopus Teacher” defied convention

#45

Post by awb »

shuntress wrote: post #36
BEEdwards wrote: post #22

I did not like this documentary at all, i don't get the point of it at all... A privileged white dude complains about how he feels disconnected from his family, so he spends a year harassing an octopus. It literally tries to run away and he stalks it, it's creepy.

I was expecting some kind of mention of this guy's apparent privilege. As I recall, not even a single line in one of the talking-head section even as simple as "I've been incredibly lucky to be at a place in my life where I have the resources to make this film." I found this lack to be particularly off-putting when the general message (of this otherwise good documentary) is more-or-less "You can strengthen your soul…

> I was expecting some kind of mention of this guy's apparent privilege.

What's the goal of this though?

Any popular documentary is the result of privilege somewhere along the line.

Either it's self-funded by a privileged person, or it raised money from privileged people. Either way, all the content you're able to view on TV, streaming or in the movies is because someone along the line had the privilege to make the film, promote it and distribute it. And those privileged people are likely the ones benefiting the most from it.

So is the goal to just acknowledge when the protagonist has privilege or should everyone involved in the film do it?

Re: “My Octopus Teacher” defied convention

#46

Post by simmerup »

Falling3 wrote: post #43
gregshap wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also frowned upon when done to humans, but accepted by most humans in regard to animals: slavery, raising for food, taxidermy, hunting for sport, neutering and keeping as pets, etc. Some people don't think this treatment is appropriate for non-human animals either. Personally I eat other animals, but I'm against both eugenics and cannibalism.

The problem is most people do not have a rational basis for the differences in the behaviors you outlined. The reasoning generally rests completely on logical fallacies.

It's very rational to want the treatment of humans to be held to a high standard when you yourself are a human.

Re: “My Octopus Teacher” defied convention

#47

Post by shuntress »

awb wrote: post #45
shuntress wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was expecting some kind of mention of this guy's apparent privilege. As I recall, not even a single line in one of the talking-head section even as simple as "I've been incredibly lucky to be at a place in my life where I have the resources to make this film." I found this lack to be particularly off-putting when the general message (of this otherwise good documentary) is more-or-less "You can strengthen your soul…

> I was expecting some kind of mention of this guy's apparent privilege. What's the goal of this though? Any popular documentary is the result of privilege somewhere along the line. Either it's self-funded by a privileged person, or it raised money from privileged people. Either way, all the content you're able to view on TV, streaming or in the movies is because someone along the line had the privilege to make the f…

This specific story is explicitly personal and delivers a personal message, rather than an objective "Here is an octopus in it's natural environment."

"I was unhappy in my life so I spent time personally connecting with and understanding nature and now I feel more fulfilled and whole as a person" is likely to cause viewers who think "Yikes, I sure wish I could afford to drop everything go swimming every day" to respond with resentment. A small acknowledgement of this disconnect can be enough to bring those viewers back in to engage with the core message.

The "goal" is to craft a more resonant/engaging story. I think you need to assess why you have assumed I have some sort of agenda or why this should apply in the exact same way to all media.

Re: “My Octopus Teacher” defied convention

#48

Post by jbotz »

simmerup wrote: post #46
Falling3 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is most people do not have a rational basis for the differences in the behaviors you outlined. The reasoning generally rests completely on logical fallacies.

It's very rational to want the treatment of humans to be held to a high standard when you yourself are a human.

But I am also a primate, mammal, vertebrate, animal, terran life-form. And going the other direction I am homo sapiens as opposed to neanderthal, caucasian, German, member of my specific family. Why draw a sharp line specifically at "human"..?

Re: “My Octopus Teacher” defied convention

#49

Post by drew55555 »

jbotz wrote: post #48
simmerup wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's very rational to want the treatment of humans to be held to a high standard when you yourself are a human.

But I am also a primate, mammal, vertebrate, animal, terran life-form. And going the other direction I am homo sapiens as opposed to neanderthal, caucasian, German, member of my specific family. Why draw a sharp line specifically at "human"..?

Because humans are made in the image and likeness of God.

Re: “My Octopus Teacher” defied convention

#50

Post by Scene_Cast2 »

gregshap wrote: post #33
Avalaxy wrote: post #8

> The only thing to add to that, where you have to be slightly careful, is if an animal hasn’t got strong genes. And then you interfere and you allow that animal to procreate. You could potentially be making the gene pool weaker and more susceptible to mange. That’s where you have to be a bit careful. It's interesting that we can talk about this in such an objective and rational way when it involves non-human animal…

Also frowned upon when done to humans, but accepted by most humans in regard to animals: slavery, raising for food, taxidermy, hunting for sport, neutering and keeping as pets, etc. Some people don't think this treatment is appropriate for non-human animals either. Personally I eat other animals, but I'm against both eugenics and cannibalism.

Nit (doesn't challenge your argument), but plenty of sci-fi short stories explore (and glorify the concept of) humans as pets for some random aliens.
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