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French lawmakers approve a ban on short domestic flights

reuters.com

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Re: French lawmakers approve a ban on short domestic flights

#201

Post by elliekelly »

nobodyandproud wrote: post #124
xfitm3 wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have a disability changing modes of transportation mid-trip is an extreme hardship. I suffered an injury and needed a wheelchair for about a year while I still had to travel for work three times. You have no idea how hard basic things can be until you're incapable of doing them on your own.

I had reduced mobility for months, many years ago. Even though I was already aware of just how difficult it would be to get around, living through it gave a shocking amount of perspective. Some of the disability accommodations (disability parking) were pure bullshit. Elevators and ramps were godsends. A large, standing shower without steps and room for a stool were musts. A taste of what’s to come, when I get older.…

I think it’s important to remember that accommodations accommodate a wide range of people and so they’re not one-size-fits all. A parking spot might have been a “bullshit” accommodation for your situation but for others it might be absolutely critical. If an accommodation isn’t necessary for someone’s disability they’re free to leave it open for someone who does.

Re: French lawmakers approve a ban on short domestic flights

#202

Post by fredophile »

inter_netuser wrote: post #194
fredophile wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd agree in terms of distance and traffic between the two cities. However, the long, relatively severe winters would probably add some complications to high speed rail.

Check out the rail to Bergen, in Norway. Shot in 4K. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atyvdC15HFA

A quick search on Google tells me that train goes at 160 km/h. Not exactly high speed. It looks like they don't run into too many problems with weather related cancelations or delays though [0].

[0] https://www.globalrailwayreview.com/article/74614/norway-rai...

Re: French lawmakers approve a ban on short domestic flights

#203

Post by fredophile »

wirrbel wrote: post #187
fredophile wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd agree in terms of distance and traffic between the two cities. However, the long, relatively severe winters would probably add some complications to high speed rail.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Siberian_Railway Snow isn't an obstacle to trains (unless you don't want trains to be a reality).

The trans siberian railway isn't high speed. There are plans to make some of it high speed but the only article I could find was from 2018 and at that time it was still only in the early planning stages and expected to cost billions of USD [0].

[0] https://www.railway-technology.com/features/moscow-kazan-hig....

(Edited to fix an autocorrect correction from my phone)

Re: French lawmakers approve a ban on short domestic flights

#204

Post by djcapelis »

bartread wrote: post #159
xfitm3 wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have a disability changing modes of transportation mid-trip is an extreme hardship. I suffered an injury and needed a wheelchair for about a year while I still had to travel for work three times. You have no idea how hard basic things can be until you're incapable of doing them on your own.

You don't even need to be disabled for this to become a serious problem: just take a trip where you need to carry more than one large, heavy, or delicate item of luggage. Switching modes is easy[0] if you're able-bodied and able to travel light. If either or both of those things becomes untrue it's a different story. [0] Note that switching modes always costs time, sometimes significant amounts of time. In some cases…

> [0] Note that switching modes always costs time, sometimes significant amounts of time. In some cases it's time you may not have or may not be able to easily find.

When I land at SFO from an international flight, I’m on BART way before anyone could board a second flight after clearing customs.

Switching modes doesn’t have to cost any more time than switching vehicles within the same mode. You just have to design the systems to do it well. Train to bus isn’t magically less efficient than bus to bus. Neither is Airbus to train.

Switching to and from cars is pretty bad and usually inefficient though, that I think we can all agree on.

Re: French lawmakers approve a ban on short domestic flights

#205

Post by Scoundreller »

oleganza wrote: post #164

This may also seem like a nice cover up for French gov messing up economy and having companies go bankrupt / close destinations. "Looks, the flights disappeared not because we fucked things up, but because we are proactively saving the planet here!"

Canada kinda did this by banning flights from EU except through 4 airports at the beginning of the pandemic. But flights to those non-4 airports from EU were doomed anyway, but now airlines wouldn't owe compensation.

Re: French lawmakers approve a ban on short domestic flights

#206

Post by [deleted] »

keiferski wrote: post #76
ur-whale wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

LOL, you clearly haven't had to travel CDG center of Paris by train very often. What you say is true (there is a train), but the quality of service is so bad (strikes, trains late or overcrowded, broken ticket machines, broken escalators, PITA to go from gate to train terminal) that most people who can afford it would rather be stuck in freeway jams in a taxi than consider taking the train.

I was replying to the above comment's reference to connections. It is fairly easy to fly into Paris and take a train to Lyon, for example, without having to go into Paris proper first.

[deleted]

Re: French lawmakers approve a ban on short domestic flights

#207

Post by [deleted] »

publicola1990 wrote: post #110
Mister_Snuggles wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to regularly travel from Edmonton to Calgary for work. When you add up the extra time required for flying, it's about a three hour trip (45 minutes in the air, the rest is getting to the airport, checking in, etc). Coincidentally, it's also about a three hour drive. My reasons for driving vs flying were usually to do with how long I'd be there. If I was going for one day then flying was preferable since fallin…

In general though flying is much safer than highway driving. If one wanted to minimize risk, one would always fly.

[deleted]

Re: French lawmakers approve a ban on short domestic flights

#208

Post by jcranmer »

kazen44 wrote: post #195
jcranmer wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Knowing the history of railroads, this comment is truly spit-take worthy. Railroads are my go-to example for what the "model" capitalistic industry looks like. Historically, the investment boom/bust cycles were driven in large part by railroad mania--most railroads in the 19th century were funded by public stock offerings to raise the capital to build them, producing and popping investment bubbles with almost decadal…

to give you a bit of history from the European perspective. most railways in Europe have been build by state programs to kickstart further industrialisation during the later half of the 19th century. prior to rail, the only way to transport bulk goods like coal and iron ore efficiently was through canalways. rails solved the issue of getting the raw goods to the industrial centers where people lived to produce goods…

I believe that's largely a Central/Eastern European perspective, and doesn't apply as much to Western Europe. Countries like the UK, France, Switzerland started out with entirely private systems and nationalized them later (early 20th century).

Re: French lawmakers approve a ban on short domestic flights

#209

Post by Teever »

Mister_Snuggles wrote: post #82
tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #4

There is no reason to fly short distance if you want to go from city center to city center. However, if you're already arriving or leaving on a long distance flight, the whole overhead of getting to/from/through the airport disappears and those 1.5 hours start making a difference. I think forcing companies to advertise more honest flight durations and prices could make a huge difference. If the airline tells you that…

I used to regularly travel from Edmonton to Calgary for work. When you add up the extra time required for flying, it's about a three hour trip (45 minutes in the air, the rest is getting to the airport, checking in, etc). Coincidentally, it's also about a three hour drive. My reasons for driving vs flying were usually to do with how long I'd be there. If I was going for one day then flying was preferable since fallin…

The Red Arrow bus line from Edmonton to Calgary is the best of both worlds. Pick-up/Drop-offs from city core to city core as well as other stops along the way, Free wifi and beverages on the bus, decent seats for working during the stress free commute.

Re: French lawmakers approve a ban on short domestic flights

#210

Post by indymike »

stordoff wrote: post #138
nobodyandproud wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had reduced mobility for months, many years ago. Even though I was already aware of just how difficult it would be to get around, living through it gave a shocking amount of perspective. Some of the disability accommodations (disability parking) were pure bullshit. Elevators and ramps were godsends. A large, standing shower without steps and room for a stool were musts. A taste of what’s to come, when I get older.…

I'm not sure what you mean about parking. I have a disability, and personally, parking is the most important adaptation.

Grew up with a father who was in a full-time wheelchair. Issue one was availability of spaces. It was amazing to watch people park, hop out of their car and jog in to the store (Dad would say, "being brain dead is a disability, too.). Second issue was having enough space to open the ramp (I'll never forget the time someone parked next to the ramp side door as we were leaving the store. I asked the guy to move and he said no. Fortunately, on my way out a police officer was coming into the store... the county impound moved the car). Third issue is that sometimes the distance between parking and store entrance was quite far.
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