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Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama

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Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama

#831

Post by yuppie_scum »

FearlessNebula wrote: post #590
Diederich wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, you're not kidding. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bessemer,_Alabama#Economy "Crime increased following the rise in unemployment and social disruption from the decline of manufacturing industries in the area. As of 2019 Bessemer ranks first in terms of violent crimes for US cities with 25,000 or more people." Population has fallen from its peak in 1970 of 33k to 26k today. Thanks for the reference. EDIT: Also hom…

I'm stupid, but why does unemployment cause violent crime?

The easiest way to answer this is to just say go watch The Wire.

Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama

#832

Post by macintux »

jandrese wrote: post #673
FearlessNebula wrote: post #590

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm stupid, but why does unemployment cause violent crime?

Are you asking why people who have run out of money might turn to stealing? Even if you are trying to be nonviolent a life of crime is hard and eventually you'll find yourself in a situation where you have to use violence because there is nothing else to turn to. You certainly can't go to the cops.

Plus, once you have a felony on your record, your job prospects go to absolute shit, so it’s hard to avoid crime as a way to survive.

Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama

#833

Post by macintux »

khc wrote: post #816
TurkishPoptart wrote: post #753

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rightly so, but the issue is that the conditions pertaining to work in an Amazon warehouse do not lend themselves to being the kind of work one can do for decades+. People burn out, their legs grow week, and they get no insurance benefits for physical therapy, and that sort of thing. It's just not a sustainable job for most people, sadly.

is it different from manufacturing work or work in service industry?

Amazon is infamous for absolutely driving their warehouse employees into the ground.

I suspect manufacturing is somewhat less casual about their employees’ health because much of it is unionized, and training is more difficult. Warehouse workers are considered disposable.

And the service industry is light years easier than warehouse work, at least based on my time in both.

Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama

#834

Post by lmilcin »

aarongray wrote: post #127

Speaking as someone who lives adjacent to Bessemer but who does not work at Amazon, you need to understand that Bessemer is a dying city, a slum. These were the best paying jobs that many of these workers had had in their entire lives, it is no wonder that a majority of them decided not to bite the hand that was feeding them.

I wonder how much of this is strategy.

Find a dying city with huge unemployment. No problem finding workers for a factory where most employees don't require anything more than ability to walk and read.

Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama

#835

Post by lupire »

lmilcin wrote: post #834
aarongray wrote: post #127

Speaking as someone who lives adjacent to Bessemer but who does not work at Amazon, you need to understand that Bessemer is a dying city, a slum. These were the best paying jobs that many of these workers had had in their entire lives, it is no wonder that a majority of them decided not to bite the hand that was feeding them.

I wonder how much of this is strategy. Find a dying city with huge unemployment. No problem finding workers for a factory where most employees don't require anything more than ability to walk and read.

That's a complicated way of saying "open shop where labor is cheap".

This why we need national and international coordination on minimum wage and minimum work environment laws.

Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama

#836

Post by lupire »

charlescearl wrote: post #448
aarongray wrote: post #127

Speaking as someone who lives adjacent to Bessemer but who does not work at Amazon, you need to understand that Bessemer is a dying city, a slum. These were the best paying jobs that many of these workers had had in their entire lives, it is no wonder that a majority of them decided not to bite the hand that was feeding them.

As someone whose great uncles worked in the steel factories nearby, whose parents before that labored in the cotton fields, I can also testify the multi-century efforts of Black workers who fought the “hands that was fedding them”. America's Johannesburg [1] and Hammer and Hoe [2] for reference. [1] https://ugapress.org/book/9780820356273/americas-johannesbur... [2] https://uncpress.org/book/9781469625485/hammer-and-…

That gets harder as capital gets easier to move.

Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama

#837

Post by lmilcin »

lupire wrote: post #835
lmilcin wrote: post #834

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder how much of this is strategy. Find a dying city with huge unemployment. No problem finding workers for a factory where most employees don't require anything more than ability to walk and read.

That's a complicated way of saying "open shop where labor is cheap". This why we need national and international coordination on minimum wage and minimum work environment laws.

I think Amazon fulfillment centers are a special case. Most people working there either move packages around or drive a truck. At least that is my understanding, somebody with better/first hand knowledge would be welcome to share.

Normally having a huge employer would be a boon to the city, but most of these people are going to be working for close to minimum wage and Amazon most likely negotiated with the city so they don't have to pay a dime.

Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama

#838

Post by markdown »

FearlessNebula wrote: post #590
Diederich wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, you're not kidding. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bessemer,_Alabama#Economy "Crime increased following the rise in unemployment and social disruption from the decline of manufacturing industries in the area. As of 2019 Bessemer ranks first in terms of violent crimes for US cities with 25,000 or more people." Population has fallen from its peak in 1970 of 33k to 26k today. Thanks for the reference. EDIT: Also hom…

I'm stupid, but why does unemployment cause violent crime?

It doesn't in developed countries, because they have a strong social safety net.

But in countries going through late stage capitalism, if you don't have a job, you have to rob your neighbour to eat.

Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama

#839

Post by NovemberWhiskey »

wolfsayswof wrote: post #688
quijoteuniv wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While that might be right,You are not taking into account that in Europe you get free healthcare & education.

That and more: 1. universal disability benefits 2. usually min 20 days of vacation 3. pension 4. unemployment benefits incomparable to the US 5. unpaid overtime is usually taboo I live in the US (originally from EU) and I don't like people arguing the EU healthcare sucks without experiencing it themselves. No matter what your job/status is, you don't have to be scared to see any doctor - dentist, specialist, eye doct…

Well, specifics vary; like in the U.K. - good luck on finding an NHS dentist. Virtually everyone I knew in the U.K. had private dentistry despite it putatively being covered by the NHS.

Re: Amazon workers vote against unionizing in Alabama

#840

Post by labcomputer »

toby wrote: post #498
yibg wrote: post #477

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone points to SAG as an example of a good union. But how many of these are there? If there are dozens of examples of "bad unions" and a single example of a "good union", that doesn't exactly give someone voting to unionize high confidence.

That's because SAG is a guild, not a union, and it works because every known actor is voluntarily a member, so you can't make a movie without agreeing to their rules.

That's because true Scotsmen are not allowed to join SAG.
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