Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

theconversation.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 764 posts

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#81

Post by jedberg »

burlesona wrote: post #29
m463 wrote: post #5

I wonder if telecommuting like many are doing right now trumps everything .

Unfortunately, no. Surprisingly, telecommuters appear to drive more than office workers: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S09658...

I'd like to dig into that study, because it feels impossible to me. Whether I work at home or an office, I have the same errands to run. Either way I'm going to plan my trip.

The only thing I can think of is that I might spread out the errands more across the week since I don't have to do it after work.

But anecdotally, my wife and I both started being home full time six years ago, and despite have kids since then (which greatly adds to the places one needs to go), our overall milage went way down, to the point where we even got rid of a car. After the pandemic, when the kids start doing a lot more after school activities, we may not even get a second car because Uber/Lyft can cover the rare trip that needs to happen simultaneously.

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#82

Post by garyrichardson »

> This is partly because electric cars aren’t truly zero-carbon – mining the raw materials for their batteries, manufacturing them and generating the electricity they run on produces emissions.

Ok. But then unless you're hand making the bikes out of wood you scavenged from fallen trees and don't use rubber tires, neither are bikes.

Like many pro cycling articles this one is one sided and assumes there is one solution to our environmental problems. Sure, we need people to cycle more, but we also need electric cars, changes in how and where we live, changes in what we eat, etc.

Probably the fastest way to impact all of this is internalizing the cost of carbon into all of our activities.. ie a big fat carbon tax.

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#83

Post by bryanlarsen »

twiddling wrote: post #8
s0rce wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why isn't this actionable? We are currently making significant public and private investments into electric cars based on their reduced emissions. Why not also invest in cycling infrastructure (beyond the very limited capacity that most US cities are currently doing)?

Because most US cities are not compact and flat as Copenhagen

The cycling rate in Århus Denmark is almost as good as Copenhagen and it's quite a hilly city.

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#84

Post by duxup »

acwan93 wrote: post #69

There's a demonization of cyclists in general if you live in an American city. Until this stigma goes away, which will usher in infrastructure and mentality changes, this will not occur. City councils believe cycling is recreational, not for commuting or for "real" use. I mentioned this about getting my LA suburb to actually embrace Class II bike lanes previously, and there's simply no political will. Simply put, it'…

I would say there's a demonetization of everything these days where so many topics are full 'us vs them' tribal ordeals now.

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#85

Post by jedberg »

ab111111111 wrote: post #60
jedberg wrote: post #35

Switching from gas to electric is something I can do all on my own. Switching from gas car to cycling is something that would require major investments from my city and developers. Both are noble goals, but let's not let perfect be the enemy of good. Switch to electric now, and also encourage new roads and new developments to be bike friendly, so that switching to a bike is something that will be viable in 20 or 30 y…

What major investment would be required from the city or developers to set up cycling infrastructure? Painting some cycle lanes onto the roads? Marking a few car parking places as bike parking places? That's all that cycling infrastructure really is, so it's super cheap. A lot cheaper than, say, building charging stations for electric cars.

Building offices and commercial buildings closer to homes. Most cities are not bikeable because it's just too far to get to anything that isn't a home.

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#87

Post by ericd »

ab111111111 wrote: post #60
jedberg wrote: post #35

Switching from gas to electric is something I can do all on my own. Switching from gas car to cycling is something that would require major investments from my city and developers. Both are noble goals, but let's not let perfect be the enemy of good. Switch to electric now, and also encourage new roads and new developments to be bike friendly, so that switching to a bike is something that will be viable in 20 or 30 y…

What major investment would be required from the city or developers to set up cycling infrastructure? Painting some cycle lanes onto the roads? Marking a few car parking places as bike parking places? That's all that cycling infrastructure really is, so it's super cheap. A lot cheaper than, say, building charging stations for electric cars.

A very large percentage of the population are uncomfortable biking when there’s only a line of paint between them and automobiles. Separated bike lanes (ideally with physical barriers) increase the percentage of the population that will be willing to bike very considerably. If biking is going to make a major impact, we need that level of infrastructure change on at least some set of major thoroughfares in cities.

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#88

Post by clairity »

elmomle wrote: post #23
phnofive wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no evidence to suggest millions of bicycle commuters are waiting in the wings for more green paint.

When it comes to transportation infrastructure, you certainly don't want to plan the future based on apparent present demand. Los Angeles vs Copenhagen is a great comparison of the results of continually building for what people seem to want "now" (in the former case) versus building to create a better future.

LA actually has decent public transportation now, and it's getting better. it's also the perfect city for biking, with lower temperature variances, elevation variances, and precipitation rates than most cities. we just need to convert on-street parking into bike lanes everywhere, and we'd be all set (with protected lanes built out over time).

LA may have been the poster child of poor planning in the 80's, but i'd suggest cities like phoenix, houston and atlanta have surpassed it in that regard.

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#89

Post by estebank »

FredPret wrote: post #75
refactor_master wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“There’s no such thing as bad weather”.

Try cycling through 3ft of snow or on ice... with snow-plows lumbering by. Even if you're walking, -20C and below is just too damn cold even if you have proper gear.

> Try cycling through 3ft of snow or on ice... with snow-plows lumbering by.

That sounds like bad infrastructure, which admittedly is the default almost everywhere.

Re: Cycling is more important than electric cars for reaching net-zero cities

#90

Post by twiddling »

miahi wrote: post #70
vcanhoto wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Dutch would disagree with you pretty much with every single point. Except the last one, maybe.

They do have a lot of advantages: a flat country, good infrastructure for cycling, cool climate. That means you don't sweat on the way to work so you don't need showers and to change clothes.

Small country, high density, etc.
Post reply on HN