Ask HN: What novel tools are you using to write web sites/apps? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: What novel tools are you using to write web sites/apps?

#231

Post by alanpearce » Mon, Apr 05, 2021, 2:27 PM UTC

simplify wrote: post #37

recursivedoubts wrote: post #5

I am working on two alternative tools for building web apps: https://htmx.org - uses HTML attributes and HTML-over-the-wire for AJAX/Web Socket/SSE interactions https://hyperscript.org - an experimental front end programming language derived from HyperTalk that is event-oriented and that removes the distinction between synchronous and asynchronous code. Both tools are HTML-oriented and are designed to be embedded dir…

I'm not sure what came first, but it's unfortunate that hyperscript.org clashes with hyperscript, the pure JavaScript notation to describe HTML.

hyperscript (`h()`) had its first commit 9 years ago and the syntax is common in other rendering libraries (e.g. mithril, ivi).

_hyperscript (this one) seems to have released 0.0.1 only last year.

Definitely very confusing on the naming front. It is at least possible to disambiguate searches with the underscore.

Re: Ask HN: What novel tools are you using to write web sites/apps?

#232

Post by kouteiheika » Mon, Apr 05, 2021, 2:29 PM UTC

pknerd wrote: post #191

kouteiheika wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Currently 4.29 EUR/month VPS on Hetzner. (Although I have some fun features planned and might need some more processing power so I might upgrade in the future.) They have great AMD-based VMs, 2x perf/$ over Intel. (I've benchmarked.)

How much traffic per month does it cover in this amount? I want to launch some toy projects and confuses whether go for AWS or vps.

20 TB.

I would definitely recommend going with a VPS over AWS in your case, unless you want to play with AWS-specific tech to build up your resume.

Re: Ask HN: What novel tools are you using to write web sites/apps?

#233

Post by crazypython » Mon, Apr 05, 2021, 2:31 PM UTC

busymom0 wrote: post #110

crazypython wrote: post #3

Semantic HTML, CSS, Vanilla JS, and JAMStack. Semantic: embed data directly in HTML. If I have a list of wines with categories, each wine's "class" attribute has a class for each category. HTML: can be generated by anything and consumed by anyone. Great SEO. CSS: These websites were all made with the same HTML, only CSS changing. http://www.csszengarden.com/ Let's imagine we have a checkbox, that when checked, should…

Wow at this one: http://www.csszengarden.com/219/

Indeed, and that website only uses 2010 CSS features.

Re: Ask HN: What novel tools are you using to write web sites/apps?

#234

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Apr 05, 2021, 2:33 PM UTC

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: What novel tools are you using to write web sites/apps?

#235

Post by ecesena » Mon, Apr 05, 2021, 2:34 PM UTC

dejj wrote: post #94

ecesena wrote: post #46

Fav thread ever! A good 5+ years ago I built HasGluten [1] with react backed by a google spreadsheet, hosted on github pages. Proven technology, it's still working. More recently I hacked together MultiPreview [2] with react + API served by firebase functions. I'm also temp using firebase hosting as I have little traffic, but plan to replace it with edge computing / CDN caching. MultiPreview is backed by Saasform [3]…

You might want to check hasgluten.com's cert: >> Firefox does not trust this site because it uses a certificate that is not valid for hasgluten.com. The certificate is only valid for the following names: www.github.com, .github.com, github.com, .github.io, github.io, *.githubusercontent.com, githubusercontent.com

Thanks - fixing.

Re: Ask HN: What novel tools are you using to write web sites/apps?

#236

Post by eloff » Mon, Apr 05, 2021, 2:37 PM UTC

jasfi wrote: post #49

kouteiheika wrote: post #25

This partially might be more of a what's old is new again, but here's what I use: - 100% server side rendered - Progressively enhanced (fully works without JS, but having JS enabled makes it nicer) - In select places where I need SPA-like snappiness I use a ~100 line long DOM diffing algorithm (I request full HTML through AJAX and diff it into the current page; if the user has no JS enabled then the page just refresh…

No SQL database is the one thing I disagree with. What if you want to write a SQL query/report? Do you have transactions? As the app gets bigger you might want that.

Yeah, this seems problematic. What if you hard power off your server, how do you know your data didn't get corrupted? As someone who has written databases, and knows how difficult this is to get right, it makes my skin crawl.

Backups and restore will also have to be DIY. Point in time restore probably won't be possible - and that's a life saver when you need it.

Re: Ask HN: What novel tools are you using to write web sites/apps?

#237

Post by cholmon » Mon, Apr 05, 2021, 2:39 PM UTC

tersers wrote: post #168

This is the first thread in a long while that's given me a lot of FOMO anxiety. I've made a lot of one-off server-side rendered apps in Flask, and right now I'm doing some backend work ASP.NET Core for my job, but I have this overwhelming feeling there's so much I don't know and I'm not sure where to start. I only bring this up in case I'm not the only person sharing these feelings.

I feel this a lot too, but I find that I can quell the anxiety by looking at the huge list of $things_i_dont_know not as a chronicle of how far behind the curve I am, but instead as a buffet of new techniques/technologies that I can sample. Many will be irrelevant to the things I'm building, but some will likely help improve my productivity or ease my maintenance burden.

So I try to have a taste of one or two new things every so often; try them out on a couple of projects to see if they help me, or if they just confuse and overcomplicate. I'll never be able to try them all, but I feel like I slowly get a better understanding of many of the new items, and feel a bit better about ignoring things that I've already established aren't likely to help me to be more productive.

Re: Ask HN: What novel tools are you using to write web sites/apps?

#238

Post by MH15 » Mon, Apr 05, 2021, 2:39 PM UTC

sbazerque wrote: post #221

It is somewhat whacky, but what I'm doing is: I created a library to have distributed data types directly on the browser [1]. So there are no servers, data is sync'd directly between people's browsers. Then I created a library to bind react components directly to my distributed data types [2]. So the app is just a static page, hosted anywhere, that works as an SPA. [1] https://github.com/hyperhyperspace/hyperhyperspa…

This is very interesting. I've seen similar peer to peer work with the DAT browser but this looks like it works in existing browsers. I'll definitely be checking it out.

Re: Ask HN: What novel tools are you using to write web sites/apps?

#239

Post by jaywalk » Mon, Apr 05, 2021, 2:41 PM UTC

globular-toast wrote: post #129

kouteiheika wrote: post #25

This partially might be more of a what's old is new again, but here's what I use: - 100% server side rendered - Progressively enhanced (fully works without JS, but having JS enabled makes it nicer) - In select places where I need SPA-like snappiness I use a ~100 line long DOM diffing algorithm (I request full HTML through AJAX and diff it into the current page; if the user has no JS enabled then the page just refresh…

> Progressively enhanced (fully works without JS, but having JS enabled makes it nicer) This is something I've struggled to get developers to understand forever. It doesn't help that no browser really allows users to switch off js. The number of developers who think doing client-side validation on forms is enough is far too high!

Regardless of JS vs no JS, only validating forms on the client side is just an awful practice begging for trouble.

Re: Ask HN: What novel tools are you using to write web sites/apps?

#240

Post by cheeseblubber » Mon, Apr 05, 2021, 2:41 PM UTC

Client side: React - Typescript Backend: Phoneix - Elixir

We're a live message tool and it is basically what Elixir is built for https://github.com/papercups-io/papercups.

The Elixir community has been great and incredibly friendly. I originally was worried about the size of the community but that hasn't been an issue the community has been super helpful. I also think the annual stackoverflow usage surveys are very misleading because most of the community's questions get asked in ElixirForum and not on Stackoverflow.

Phoneix is the web framework of Elixir which is very similar to Rails but minus a lot of the magic has been very helpful for our productivity as well.

If I had to built another service that is websocket heavy I would definitely use Elixir. Even if it was a standard crud app I would still most likely choose Elixir.