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Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

reuters.com

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Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#161

Post by throwaway09223 »

IgorPartola wrote: post #130
turing_complete wrote: post #117

Good thing hacker news doesn't run large civil engineering projects.

You know, I used to think that HN was a collection of some of the smartest people on the Internet. Don’t get me wrong, there are some incredible people here. But I guess what I have learned over the past 10 years is that HN has as many blind spots as any other online forum. If you want SV advice, this is the place to be. If you want to dislodge a stuck mega ship, look elsewhere.

I just re-read that old thread and to be honest, on the whole the advice there is sound. I saw comments discounting the fanciful speculation outnumbering the speculation by at least a multiple of two.

There are silly ideas in every forum. I've been on plenty groups comprised entirely of tech experts and I can confidently say that foolish ideas will be proposed even in the most elite of circles, even in their areas of specialty. It happens, and as long as there are other reasonable voices it's fine.

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#162

Post by ZeKZ »

pqb wrote: post #60

I wish to see a satellite photos to see a traffic jam from the above. It is definitely not too common to see that many ships waiting in queue to entry the Suez canal [0]. [0]: https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/home/centerx:32.3/cente...

https://www.reddit.com/r/Damnthatsinteresting/comments/mf705...

https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/comments/meopv9/s...

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#163

Post by kibwen »

IgorPartola wrote: post #130
turing_complete wrote: post #117

Good thing hacker news doesn't run large civil engineering projects.

You know, I used to think that HN was a collection of some of the smartest people on the Internet. Don’t get me wrong, there are some incredible people here. But I guess what I have learned over the past 10 years is that HN has as many blind spots as any other online forum. If you want SV advice, this is the place to be. If you want to dislodge a stuck mega ship, look elsewhere.

It's the classic "expertise is universal" fallacy. When we see someone who is an expert in their field, we assume that expertise carries over to totally unrelated fields, when this is emphatically not the case. Being a genius does not prevent someone from being ignorant; the finite nature of time means every genius is almost completely uninformed on almost every topic, and without information what you get is GIGO.

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#164

Post by tgv »

Trasmatta wrote: post #140

I honestly love that it was freed using the "boring" solution. No need for any of the crazy solutions people proposed on the internet. Just careful and measured execution of proven techniques.

Not surprised. It's directly available, and there's a lot of experience. And the consequences and costs are known. But probably other companies were already working on alternatives. I wouldn't be surprised if Elon would send a small, custom built sub next week.

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#165

Post by jethro_tell »

IgorPartola wrote: post #130
turing_complete wrote: post #117

Good thing hacker news doesn't run large civil engineering projects.

You know, I used to think that HN was a collection of some of the smartest people on the Internet. Don’t get me wrong, there are some incredible people here. But I guess what I have learned over the past 10 years is that HN has as many blind spots as any other online forum. If you want SV advice, this is the place to be. If you want to dislodge a stuck mega ship, look elsewhere.

There's a whole industry around ship recovery and they know how to do things like patch things back together with some light underwater welding and then pump the water back out the hole in the bottom with compressed air. Lots of times, this is done while the ship is busy worrying itself to death on a reef.

Ship salvage is a combination of batshit crazy and real-time engineering marvel with a healthy dose of understanding tides waves and currents. There's also a strange maritime law business going on where the captain and or insurance company have to sign a contract. IF the ship is a 'wreck' the salvage company gets what ever they can save or whatever it's agreed on in the contract. If it just needs some help, the contract will be lighter. But many ships have sunk completely while the insurance company and salvage company have argued over whether it was a total loss or just suck in a low tide.

I always find the salvage stories to be super interesting. Seeing people do hard ball business while the ship is breaking up under them is really something else.

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#166

Post by hderms »

leoh wrote: post #157
exikyut wrote: post #90

Oh hey, they fixed it, - without destroying or imposing significant additional damage to any of the cargo - without destroying or imposing significant additional damage to the ship - without taking multiple weeks - without needing to ship a trillion dollars'+ worth of equipment halfway around the world It's refreshing to see high-end engineering performed so competently.

There appears to be little "high-end engineering." Just a high tide and a bunch of tug boats.

A high tide and some tug boats becomes 'high-end engineering' if it works

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#167

Post by signal11 »

JosephRedfern wrote: post #62

Lots of articles quote a $XXX billion dollars per day figure, but those numbers are normally for "worth of goods delayed" which, while interesting, doesn't tell the story to me. Are there any estimates as to the actual cost of this "mishap", due to e.g. spoilage, financial/contractual repercussions of late deliveries, personnel/fuel costs?

I'd start by computing the number of ships that went around the Southern tip of Africa as a result of the stuck ship. I wonder how much the cost of extra fuel and food/pay for all of those ships doing additional miles will be? And the resulting increase in wholesale/retail costs?

Regarding penalties re late delivery, I'm less worried about that. Cargo ships always have language about loss and force majeure. I think a stuck ship would qualify as force majeure. And a week shouldn't affect most perishables e.g. grain, that go into containers.

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#168

Post by philip1209 »

JosephRedfern wrote: post #62

Lots of articles quote a $XXX billion dollars per day figure, but those numbers are normally for "worth of goods delayed" which, while interesting, doesn't tell the story to me. Are there any estimates as to the actual cost of this "mishap", due to e.g. spoilage, financial/contractual repercussions of late deliveries, personnel/fuel costs?

Also, are there any paths for supply chain interruption insurance to kick in?

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#169

Post by PragmaticPulp »

leoh wrote: post #157
exikyut wrote: post #90

Oh hey, they fixed it, - without destroying or imposing significant additional damage to any of the cargo - without destroying or imposing significant additional damage to the ship - without taking multiple weeks - without needing to ship a trillion dollars'+ worth of equipment halfway around the world It's refreshing to see high-end engineering performed so competently.

There appears to be little "high-end engineering." Just a high tide and a bunch of tug boats.

High end engineering uses the simplest and most cost effective solution to get the job done right.

It would have been a mistake to throw expensive, complicated solutions at a problem that had a relatively simple solution.

Re: Suez Canal says traffic in channel resumes after stranded ship refloated

#170

Post by croutonwagon »

rovr138 wrote: post #135
abhiminator wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That thread was a good chuckle though -- a bunch of mostly software devs brainstorming on freeing one of the biggest containers ships from their comfy armchairs. [0] [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26585282

I learned how not to get rid of a whale at least. In case I’m ever asked about that...

"The remaining chunks were of such a size, no respectable seagull would attempt to tackle anyway."

This guy assume gull's are respectable.

Man I hope this guy had an amazing career, because that was an awesome report.

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