Myths About Introverts • Hacker News Board

Re: Myths About Introverts

#101

Post by dkarl » Wed, Jun 15, 2011, 7:41 PM UTC

gaius wrote: post #96

yelsgib wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are seriously conflating "social anxiety disorder" and "introversion." The idea that a concert would "drain you so much it will be hard to enjoy" or that an introvert would have a tough time interacting with a group long enough to go on a rock climbing trip is essentially saying that an introverted person is somehow handicapped, or pushed to their introversion by a type of mental disorder. I identify as an introv…

You are seriously conflating "social anxiety disorder" and "introversion." This is actually LOL because when Jung coined the terms, he meant them to refer to ones relationship with the outside world. A person who explores the world alone is an extrovert, because he looks at the world outside himself. A person who is always surrounded by friends but always worries what they think is an introvert; he's looking inwards.

Jung didn't coin the word "introvert;" it's much older than that. He coined "extravert" as its opposite. Also, one of the ways Jung defined introversion and extraversion was in terms of the flow of "psychic energy": an introvert is someone whose energy is sapped by being around other people.

Re: Myths About Introverts

#102

Post by falcolas » Wed, Jun 15, 2011, 7:42 PM UTC

parfe wrote: post #42

This article is nothing more than a chain-mail style bullshit list and it's sad to see it voted up so highly. I suppose it's a nice ego-stroke for all the self described introverts, but most of the "myths" are actually supported by their counter-descriptions. The Original Source appears to be: http://www.carlkingcreative.com/10-myths-about-introverts They hate small talk. Small talk is a social skill. and when meetin…

I imagine it's being upvoted so highly because people identify with it, or find it's contents to be valuable.

Even if it is a "chain-mail style bullshit list", your condescending retorts don't give your point of view much credit.

Re: Myths About Introverts

#103

Post by jnhnum1 » Wed, Jun 15, 2011, 7:44 PM UTC

dkarl wrote: post #52

Just somebody (presumably an introvert) denying common negative generalizations about introverts without providing any supporting references or analysis. Turns out (thank you, oblique63) it was an off-the-cuff list thought up by someone who read a self-help book and was inspired to "redefine [his] entire life in a new and positive context." Seeing introversion as a preference or identity is fine as long as you have a…

Of course there are trade-offs to being introverted: No backpacking trip, but also no needing to be around people you don't care about.

You can also say that the preference of introversion is inconvenient - the fact that you don't like hanging out with these semi-arbitrary people "prevents" you from having fun. To take that to the extreme, it would be pretty convenient to always be unconditionally happy.

Re: Myths About Introverts

#104

Post by zaphar » Wed, Jun 15, 2011, 7:48 PM UTC

dkarl wrote: post #52

Just somebody (presumably an introvert) denying common negative generalizations about introverts without providing any supporting references or analysis. Turns out (thank you, oblique63) it was an off-the-cuff list thought up by someone who read a self-help book and was inspired to "redefine [his] entire life in a new and positive context." Seeing introversion as a preference or identity is fine as long as you have a…

     "What, you don't want to go to the Nicki Minaj 
     concert?" "Let me explain. You see, I'm an   
     introvert...."

I'm an introvert as some people classify them and I certainly wouldn't say that. I'm far more likely to say something along the lines of: "I'm pretty tired right now and just want to get some rest. Maybe next time. Thanks for asking though."

It's not that I don't like going to concerts. It's really more about whether I feel up to it or not. Most of the time I do since I have plenty of time to recharge during my regular schedule.

    I know that once in a while I do like smalltalk, and 
    when I think about it my ability to enjoy a social 
    situation has more to do with my mood going into it than 
    the situation itself. I get bored when I'm not engaged, 
    and I have difficulty engaging with people because 
    anxiety and stress make me shut down.

My wife who is quite a bit different in this matter than me is cheered up by a social event when she's feeling down. I on the other hand feel worse after a social event when I'm feeling down.

    If you're introverted and want some of the benefits of 
    extroversion, such as a bigger social network for 
    locating jobs and meeting women, or if you discover that 
    you really enjoy a hobby that has a large incidental but 
    unavoidable social component, then you're supposed to 
    realize those things are "just not you" and go home and 
    read a book.

I have no idea where you got this idea from. I don't know any introverts who think like this. They simply do what they want to do and pay whatever price they want to pay. Maybe they need some extra down time later because they went to a week long event with lots of people. Most of them are just fine with that.

Someone can be an introvert without being maladjusted or having an anxiety disorder.

Re: Myths About Introverts

#105

Post by lolcraft » Wed, Jun 15, 2011, 7:49 PM UTC

crazymik3 wrote: post #43

Monkeyget wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Social niceties serve as a grease that makes the social interaction go smoothly. By avoiding those and being frank and direct you only introduce sand in the mechanism. There was a wonderful quote to this effect a while ago on HN but I can't quite find it.

I don't really understand how not going directly to the point can be better, for any mechanism.

Smalltalk is social exploration. Maybe a better word might be social probing. In this stage, you can't go directly to the point, because smalltalk is useful only in evaluating the point of a future conversation with the same partner.

Of course, people that think "no point yet" = "not valuable ever" might want to pursue philosophical nihilism until terminal depression. But I digress.

Re: Myths About Introverts

#106

Post by mcantor » Wed, Jun 15, 2011, 7:57 PM UTC

Am I the only person who just can't figure out whether I'm an "introvert" or an "extrovert" no matter how hard I try? I hate small talk (and love Smalltalk), but love meeting people. I value unfiltered honesty, but prefer effective communication. I love to be alone with my thoughts, but sometimes I just need to go out and make an idiot of myself at a party. Am I really the only person in the universe with a mutant 'vert-agnostic brain, or maybe, perhaps, are we creating some unnecessary binary distinctions here?

Re: Myths About Introverts

#107

Post by meow » Wed, Jun 15, 2011, 7:58 PM UTC

hugh3 wrote: post #69

crazymik3 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really understand how not going directly to the point can be better, for any mechanism.

And I don't really understand how thirty seconds of chit-chat about the weather is worse . Can you give me an example of the kind of small talk that you find to be painful?

30 seconds of small talk about weather with 30 people a day ... is painful..

Re: Myths About Introverts

#108

Post by mcantor » Wed, Jun 15, 2011, 7:58 PM UTC

scythe wrote: post #86

Why do we need this silly choice between being an 'introvert' and being an 'extrovert' and some fifty-cent words to hang around our necks with some attached activities we're supposed to like or dislike? I joke about how awesome it is to be "ENTP", but I don't really take that shit seriously . This whole "*-trovert" obsession drives people away from understanding conversation because they try to categorize it solely a…

It reminds me of the "alpha male/beta male" thing that leaks out of 4chan occasionally. Sometimes it's just not as easy as one or the other!

Re: Myths About Introverts

#109

Post by jdp23 » Wed, Jun 15, 2011, 8:08 PM UTC

Benjo wrote: post #97

I feel compelled to share my current process of understanding and dealing with my own introversion. Maybe this will resonate with others, maybe not. Where I am right now, it's more important for me to be able to share this than anything else. I ended a relationship recently, partly because we had huge communication issues. Her thoughts were always close to the surface, I tended to think about things for hours before…

Great description, thanks for sharing. I too am very introverted by nature, although these days people are shocked to discover it: I'm frequently acting like an extrovert, and usually enjoying it! But it's learned behavior ...

And it's a great point about how your friends' attitudes were unexpectedly contributing to your lack of energy for socialization. Over the last several years I've made it a point to spend most of my time with the friends who help me stay in the right frame of mine, instead of the ones who [unintentionally] infect me with their own negativity about new situations. And I find I'm much happier as a result!

Re: Myths About Introverts

#110

Post by Apocryphon » Wed, Jun 15, 2011, 8:09 PM UTC

dkarl wrote: post #52

Just somebody (presumably an introvert) denying common negative generalizations about introverts without providing any supporting references or analysis. Turns out (thank you, oblique63) it was an off-the-cuff list thought up by someone who read a self-help book and was inspired to "redefine [his] entire life in a new and positive context." Seeing introversion as a preference or identity is fine as long as you have a…

Well, at least he's not blaming a withdrawn personality on an actual disorder, like Asperger's.

He's just saying that some people may be introverts, with a certain type of personality, and that's it. There's nothing wrong with being a type.