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PinePhone – Beta Edition Linux SmartPhone Preorder

pine64.com

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Re: PinePhone – Beta Edition Linux SmartPhone Preorder

#51

Post by belval »

solarkraft wrote: post #31
belval wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see this comment every time something about the PinePhone is announced, but considering that this is more of a tinkering project and not so much an actual product I just don't see how relevant this is. You are not buying a Pixel 4, you are buying something that still needs a lot of work.

I personally don't expect the 2 years, but tell that to the regulator. You may be able to declare it as a DIY kit, but I have doubts. But I suppose this type of stuff is exactly what the higher priced stores are for. If you want it cheap but without support, buy directly from China.

Sure, but I doubt that they ship any kind of volume that would draw the attention of EU regulators.

Also Pine64 is from China, they are based in Hong Kong iirc. The shipping warehouse in Poland is just a place where they keep stocks.

Re: PinePhone – Beta Edition Linux SmartPhone Preorder

#52

Post by swiley »

Luker88 wrote: post #47
wwarner wrote: post #20

I personally think that the effort to create open source phones is the single most important technology project going on out there. We have open source browsers, we have open source social apps, but we definitely do not have open source phones. Phones that can be truly owned and controlled by users will reshape the privacy discourse, from one of complaining and legal coercion, to one of choices and markets.

Last month they even managed to fully open parts of the modem, and do calls without the closed blob for the firmware! https://twitter.com/biktorgj/status/1357217053745250304 (edit: caveat: they might not be able to actually ship the firmware since laws on this are very strict basically everywhere) The app store(s) is a bit of a problem, but in time it might be solved. Not a big problem for me.... But I'd also like to…

I hope the pinephone never has app stores. The "work with the community to merge your software into the repo" model is much better for things that actually help people. Apple's AppStore is best for extracting money from people while siloing their data.

Re: PinePhone – Beta Edition Linux SmartPhone Preorder

#53

Post by danShumway »

amelius wrote: post #45
linmob wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMHO, it does not have to change the duopoly, as long as it creates sustainable options for those who want to escape that duopoly. In that way it‘s already a success.

The point was: if it doesn't change the duopoly then who will write apps for the open platform? Not banks. Not governments. They will keep on developing only for Android and iOS. And people with a pinephone will have a great phone with a great OS, but with a shitty selection of apps.

I already use Linux with my bank and when I'm interacting with my government. And unlike on Android, the barrier of entry for me to write apps and set up quick solutions to problems is much lower. I don't need to run my code on a completely separate environment with no overlap. Emulation is going to be easier. I don't need to install Eclipse or whatever the heck Android devs tolerate now.

That's part of the point of using Linux -- not creating an ecosystem from scratch.

Virtually all of my computing outside of my phone is already done on Linux devices, and the setup works for day-to-day computing. Support is good enough for me. What makes you think Pinephone going to have worse support than my current Linux desktop?

My hope with Pinephone is that a decent influx of Linux phone users will improve the quality of desktop software on Linux as well, since it forces devs to stop ignoring touch screens and to start thinking about responsive design. Ideally, the desktop versions of many apps should scale on interfaces like this without needing to be rewritten. But regardless, I'm still not particularly worried that my bank website is going to stop working.

Re: PinePhone – Beta Edition Linux SmartPhone Preorder

#54

Post by mindcrime »

amelius wrote: post #45
linmob wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMHO, it does not have to change the duopoly, as long as it creates sustainable options for those who want to escape that duopoly. In that way it‘s already a success.

The point was: if it doesn't change the duopoly then who will write apps for the open platform? Not banks. Not governments. They will keep on developing only for Android and iOS. And people with a pinephone will have a great phone with a great OS, but with a shitty selection of apps.

You can still get updated software for CP/M, BeOS, DOS and OS/2 for crying out loud. Maybe not a lot, but people write / maintain that stuff. A relatively modern phone, running Linux? If it gains any adoption, I expect that the availability of apps won't be a problem. Maybe the ecosystem won't be quite as rich as Android or IOS, but it may well be "pretty good" which will be good enough for a lot of people.

Re: PinePhone – Beta Edition Linux SmartPhone Preorder

#55

Post by zepto »

Freak_NL wrote: post #27
wwarner wrote: post #20

I personally think that the effort to create open source phones is the single most important technology project going on out there. We have open source browsers, we have open source social apps, but we definitely do not have open source phones. Phones that can be truly owned and controlled by users will reshape the privacy discourse, from one of complaining and legal coercion, to one of choices and markets.

Except that it won't break the app-store duopoly. At what point will WhatsApp or even Signal consider providing a web-app, or even an open API for others to built clients against? Not doing this is a policy choice, not a technical one. Will banks offer something that doesn't require authentication via an app? Governments? App here meaning: Android or IOS. One solution might be to provide a sandbox for Android apps, b…

There is no reason it can’t break the ‘duopoly’.

It clearly isn’t going to do so overnight or in a year or two.

But it easily could over the 5-10 year timeline. A distributed App Store plus an experience that is more attuned to the needs of users than iOS or Android can accomplish that.

To solve the ‘bank’ problem all it needs to do is provide a really solid PWA story.

What it shouldn’t do is provide Android compatibility.

Re: PinePhone – Beta Edition Linux SmartPhone Preorder

#57

Post by linmob »

amelius wrote: post #45
linmob wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMHO, it does not have to change the duopoly, as long as it creates sustainable options for those who want to escape that duopoly. In that way it‘s already a success.

The point was: if it doesn't change the duopoly then who will write apps for the open platform? Not banks. Not governments. They will keep on developing only for Android and iOS. And people with a pinephone will have a great phone with a great OS, but with a shitty selection of apps.

You definitely have a point, and it‘s a pity that (desktop) Firefox recently dropped its haphazard support for Progressive Web Apps making that alternative even more unlikely to happen.

On the other hand, I would not call the App Selection shitty, see https://LINMOBapps.frama.io.

Re: PinePhone – Beta Edition Linux SmartPhone Preorder

#58

Post by amelius »

danShumway wrote: post #53
amelius wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point was: if it doesn't change the duopoly then who will write apps for the open platform? Not banks. Not governments. They will keep on developing only for Android and iOS. And people with a pinephone will have a great phone with a great OS, but with a shitty selection of apps.

I already use Linux with my bank and when I'm interacting with my government. And unlike on Android, the barrier of entry for me to write apps and set up quick solutions to problems is much lower. I don't need to run my code on a completely separate environment with no overlap. Emulation is going to be easier. I don't need to install Eclipse or whatever the heck Android devs tolerate now. That's part of the point of…

To take one example: the interaction with your bank goes through a web-browser, I suppose? You probably need a special device for 2FA? In most bank apps, you can simply log in using a PIN-code and do things like check your balance, make small wire transfers, and make payments in stores through NFC. Doing these things in a web-browser on a mobile phone with a separate 2FA device is much more cumbersome.

(I use Linux exclusively on the desktop so I know what you are talking about, but it just isn't going to work on a phone in the same way).

Re: PinePhone – Beta Edition Linux SmartPhone Preorder

#59

Post by josefresco »

fsflover wrote: post #49
josefresco wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$1999 woah https://shop.puri.sm/shop/librem-5-usa/

This is the made-in-USA edition. How much alternative phones from the USA cost? Standard edition costs $800.

I get it, I'm all for it. Objectively, it's still a lot of money even for middle class Americans.
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