Neutralizing antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 variants after infection, vaccination • Hacker News Board

Re: Neutralizing antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 variants after infection, vaccination

#81

Post by heterodoxxed » Sun, Mar 21, 2021, 6:22 PM UTC

war1025 wrote: post #33

heterodoxxed wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

| they are realistically at zero risk of severe illness. I didn't do it for me.

Every single person who "didn't do it for me" relied on an enormous network of people putting themselves at risk daily to keep the supply chains functioning. It's virtuization of fear and little else.

| at risk daily to keep the supply chains functioning

That sounds like crocodile tears to me. I don't see how going to bars and flying commercial would have made the people working in grocery delivery and amazon safer.

And it would absolutely have put the people in my life who are at the highest risk at an even greater risk if I had done so.

Re: Neutralizing antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 variants after infection, vaccination

#82

Post by inglor_cz » Sun, Mar 21, 2021, 6:22 PM UTC

maxerickson wrote: post #72

GekkePrutser wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well I will get the vaccine as soon as I can get it (which is not very soon, sadly). I'm not anti-vax, but the last few weeks the news has been all about "Don't be surprised if people still get COVID after being vaccinated". Like here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26522853 With that in mind I don't think eradication will be achievable. It only takes one person with a resistant mutation. I think we can hope to…

What does 'control' mean? In humans, if a small number of people are sick and you know who they are, you can eradicate the infection with isolation (it would only take a couple months). That it infects various animals may make that unworkable, and the difficulty in vaccinating a large percentage of people globally is another problem. But the effectiveness of the vaccines against the current variants does not appear t…

As far as zoonosis (animal-transmitted human diseases) go...

Rabies infects a lot of animals, but many places of the world are now effectively rabies-free thanks to smart inoculation of foxes etc. with baits.

We had last proven rabies case in the wild in 2002. (The Czech Republic, a landlocked continental country, not an isolated island.)

You can still fall to rabies contracted from bats if extremely unlucky, but compared to countries like India where the disease still runs rampant, rabies is a solved problem in most of Europe.

Maybe there will be a similar way to inoculate the wild mustelids against Covid one day. To be honest, human antivaxxers strike me as a bigger problem than random mink. I don't meet many mink on a regular day, but people with their masks halfway down are all too common.

Re: Neutralizing antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 variants after infection, vaccination

#83

Post by anonuser123456 » Sun, Mar 21, 2021, 6:26 PM UTC

spchampion2 wrote: post #16

This is not well aligned with other research[1] showing the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines perform little better against the B1351 (South Africa) variant than they do against plain old SARS and distantly related bat COVIDs. They're also only semi-effective against the Brazilian P1 variant. Right now, all of the vaccines are reasonably effective against the variants commonly circulating in the US (including B117), which…

The article is talking about "escape neutralization".

Neutralizing antibodies are not the only mechanism of the immune system, and the article even discusses another such mechanism: T cell immunity.

T cell immunity appears robust for all variants from the data I've seen.

Re: Neutralizing antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 variants after infection, vaccination

#84

Post by raducu » Sun, Mar 21, 2021, 6:27 PM UTC

rconti wrote: post #25

war1025 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably that patience has worn thin for the extremely overly cautious people who have been hiding in their homes for a year when they are realistically at zero risk of severe illness. We have known since early summer of last year that being fat or being old are your two biggest risk factors. Beyond that, if you have some serious pre-existing condition that makes you susceptible to all illnesses. The messaging should…

I'm a healthy male who's been "hiding in [my] home for a year". I mean, other than shopping trips, and running, and cycling, and skiing, and.. However, I've done no social events, seen no friends, etc. But, sorry if you think trying to avoid illness, trying to avoid passing on illness to others who don't have the comfort of working from home, passing on the illness to elderly family members, etc, is a waste of time.…

This whole situation is just so sad.

My uncle is in the hospital in pretty bad shape, on oxygen so far. He was spewing conspiracy shit non-stop on facebook. My father urged him to take the vaccine, then to come to the hospital sooner, he did a CT scan on my uncle, told him, showed him how messed up his lungs were, my uncle refused to be administered in the hospital, made a big fuss that the doctors wanted to kill him in the ICU; two days later he was brought in in an ambulancr.

If he was a stranger, maybe I would have laughed "serves you right", I just cannot understand how an above average intelligence person got himself brainwashed with anti-covid conspiracy theories.

Re: Neutralizing antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 variants after infection, vaccination

#85

Post by meepmorp » Sun, Mar 21, 2021, 6:27 PM UTC

anedcata wrote: post #78

outside1234 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And to pile on this, I know a triathelete in my group, 24 years old, who had it in April of LAST YEAR and is still not at 100% (can't do any hard aerobics without getting wildly out of breath). We are still in a pandemic. Stay distant.

It used to be common to reply to this sort of fear mongering with "anecdotes aren't data." Cool anecdote, bro. Sorry for that person you, a random internet person I have no reason to trust, allegedly know, who is very, very unlucky. The people in power want us to stay afraid and easy to control. Fauci says vaccines work but doesn't trust them enough to stop going into public with TWO masks! Despite being vaccinated!…

> Now commence downvoting to show you disagree! Surely it will change my mind this time!

I downvoted you because you obviously do not care at all about downvotes.

Re: Neutralizing antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 variants after infection, vaccination

#86

Post by throwaway894345 » Sun, Mar 21, 2021, 6:27 PM UTC

yorwba wrote: post #71

throwaway894345 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure why this is downvoted; it’s absolutely correct. European, Asian, and North/South American supply chains are internally integrated. A truck driver transports goods from the Czech Republic to France and unloads them at the destination. For New Zealand it’s not like the ship’s crew is unloading goods at the last mile. A similar effect is at play in Hawaii, but the latter can’t deny entry to US residents because…

> European, Asian, and North/South American supply chains are internally integrated. A truck driver transports goods from the Czech Republic to France and unloads them at the destination. But does that truck driver need to have direct contact with other people to do their job? Why can't they unload their cargo, sleep at a quarantine facility, and then drive a new truckload in the opposite direction, without an opport…

> Island nations still have internal traffic

Internal traffic among 4 million people is a much easier problem than traffic among a continent of 800 million people.

> But does that truck driver need to have direct contact with other people to do their job?

I’m sure there are better ways to do things, but truck drivers often unload shipments, confirm receipts, etc and they still need to visit truck stops and restaurants for supplies, food, etc.

> Why can't they unload their cargo, sleep at a quarantine facility, and then drive a new truckload in the opposite direction, without an opportunity to infect anyone else?

Quarantining between shipments would mean drivers are mostly idle, driving the cost of shipping through the roof. Changing supply contracts so drivers exchange cargo at the border requires completely reworking highly optimized logistics networks and isn’t going to happen in a few years, certainly not by fiat from some bureaucrat or politician that has no experience in logistics.

Re: Neutralizing antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 variants after infection, vaccination

#87

Post by paulryanrogers » Sun, Mar 21, 2021, 6:28 PM UTC

anedcata wrote: post #78

outside1234 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And to pile on this, I know a triathelete in my group, 24 years old, who had it in April of LAST YEAR and is still not at 100% (can't do any hard aerobics without getting wildly out of breath). We are still in a pandemic. Stay distant.

It used to be common to reply to this sort of fear mongering with "anecdotes aren't data." Cool anecdote, bro. Sorry for that person you, a random internet person I have no reason to trust, allegedly know, who is very, very unlucky. The people in power want us to stay afraid and easy to control. Fauci says vaccines work but doesn't trust them enough to stop going into public with TWO masks! Despite being vaccinated!…

Isn't mask wearing still required after vaccination because of the enforcement costs? I.e. it's too difficult to prove whose been vaccinated in every situation, so by requiring masks until the community reaches the target threshold

Re: Neutralizing antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 variants after infection, vaccination

#88

Post by throwaway894345 » Sun, Mar 21, 2021, 6:31 PM UTC

ghaff wrote: post #65

throwaway894345 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many entry points does Hawaii have compared to the average state? How do those points of entry compare in terms of staff and systems to operate those restrictions? Hawaii gets a lot more mileage out of its restrictions than Iowa is going to do. We can acknowledge these differences without conceding that restrictions aren’t worth the squeeze; it just means that New Zealand isn’t a good reference point.

A fair number of states did have travel restrictions in place but there were oodles of exceptions and AFAIK no real enforcement although it probably did limit cross-border travel some.

Right, but if all states had a handful of ports of entry manned by TSA who could enforce those restrictions and supply chains that were already inadvertently optimized to prevent disease transmission, then the US would probably look a lot more like New Zealand!

Re: Neutralizing antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 variants after infection, vaccination

#89

Post by maxerickson » Sun, Mar 21, 2021, 6:32 PM UTC

inglor_cz wrote: post #82

maxerickson wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does 'control' mean? In humans, if a small number of people are sick and you know who they are, you can eradicate the infection with isolation (it would only take a couple months). That it infects various animals may make that unworkable, and the difficulty in vaccinating a large percentage of people globally is another problem. But the effectiveness of the vaccines against the current variants does not appear t…

As far as zoonosis (animal-transmitted human diseases) go... Rabies infects a lot of animals, but many places of the world are now effectively rabies-free thanks to smart inoculation of foxes etc. with baits. We had last proven rabies case in the wild in 2002. (The Czech Republic, a landlocked continental country, not an isolated island.) You can still fall to rabies contracted from bats if extremely unlucky, but com…

Yeah, I would describe myself as optimistic that we can achieve a good outcome and concerned that we'll collectively make choices that delay it.

Convincing other people to stay optimistic can be part of improving the choices we make.

Re: Neutralizing antibodies against SARS-CoV-2 variants after infection, vaccination

#90

Post by inglor_cz » Sun, Mar 21, 2021, 6:32 PM UTC

anedcata wrote: post #78

outside1234 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And to pile on this, I know a triathelete in my group, 24 years old, who had it in April of LAST YEAR and is still not at 100% (can't do any hard aerobics without getting wildly out of breath). We are still in a pandemic. Stay distant.

It used to be common to reply to this sort of fear mongering with "anecdotes aren't data." Cool anecdote, bro. Sorry for that person you, a random internet person I have no reason to trust, allegedly know, who is very, very unlucky. The people in power want us to stay afraid and easy to control. Fauci says vaccines work but doesn't trust them enough to stop going into public with TWO masks! Despite being vaccinated!…

I did not downvote you, but I feel need to comment on this:

"COVID might suck but there are far worse things"

Compared to, say, Auschwitz, everything else is trivial. But that is misleading.

The dead are, well, dead, but we do not yet know how the survivors of severe Covid cases will fare long term. Given that the cohort was fairly big, they may constitute a significant challenge for healthcare capacities.

Even in warfare, crippling an enemy soldier alive is considered more efficient than killing him outright. A disabled survivor requires much more energy and attention than a dead body.