Very interesting article. I wonder about the second and third order effects of genetic engineering, but I would say I’m optimistic about a tree that’s engineered to survive a blight, whereas engineering crops so they can survive being soaked in cancer-causing poison that kills everything else in the field —- and then eating them —- seems far more concerning.
On the other hand, engineering corn to produce Bt toxin, which is harmless to mammals, such that less broad-spectrum insecticide must be applied to get the crop to harvest, seems like a straightforward win. The toxin only affects insects which actually eat the corn, so it shouldn't be contributing to the alarming crash in insect population we've been seeing worldwide.
The demise and potential revival of the American chestnut
61–70 of 90 posts
Re: The demise and potential revival of the American chestnut
#62Earlier quoted context omitted.
You should really read more about how modern herbicides work. Glyphosate disrupts a specific enzyme that only plants use. That's why genetic engineering works so well for resistance to it, you can simply eliminate the vulnerability. The issue isn't that it's cancer causing (there's next to no chance it is, the issues are with the surfactants). The real issue is that weeds are evolving to also have glyphosate resistan…
The concerning thing about glyphosate from a biochemistry standpoint is that it's a very small molecule. As any engineer knows, small objects fit in lots of holes. It's also got a phosphonic acid component which is not a normal motif in biology and could (maybe) disrupt the function of any protein that happens to bind to it. The intention of glyphosate is reasonable, but the effect can be different.
Re: The demise and potential revival of the American chestnut
#63If chestnut trees were wiped out by 1940, that means Mel Tormé & Bob Wells, writing The Christmas Song in 1946 ("chestnuts roasting on an open fire"), were already being nostalgic.
The bight is believed to have come from trees introduced from east Asia. Here in the Pacific North West there are plenty of chestnut trees. Last autumn I picked like 4 or 5 full shopping bags full of edible chestnuts. They were delicious. I’m not sure if it is from American, Chinese or even Japanese chestnuts trees though. It is highly likely that Mel Tormé and Bob Wells were roasting the east Asian chestnuts over th…
https://performingsongwriter.com/christmas-song/
> The “chestnuts roasting on an open fire” image was a memory from Wells’ childhood in Boston, when there’d be vendors on street corners at Christmas, serving up paper cones full of roasted chestnuts.
Re: The demise and potential revival of the American chestnut
#64Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not all mosquito spread disease or bite humans and the ones that do are not a major part of important ecosystems. When DEET was used heavily it didn't collapse any ecosystems. If we eliminate those species, the non-spreaders will fill the niche while eliminating major human suffering. It is not comparable to killing any sparrow sized bird.
As far as we know. My argument is that large chaotic systems are often poorly understood by us and we have gotten it wrong many times in the past. I agree that erradicating bad mosquitos feels like a win, but I personally don’t know if there’s any unforeseen effects.
Re: The demise and potential revival of the American chestnut
#65Re: The demise and potential revival of the American chestnut
#66There is a good chance in 10 years we will look back and ask ourselves why the heck it took us so long to allow the genetically engineered chestnuts. There is a big difference between genetic engineering to remove a species from existence vs reversing a bad thing we did and protect a species from going extinct. Our duty is to protect nature from us, and not not intervening when we destroy it. We did this accidentally…
I was unfamiliar with the chestnut debacle until I read The Overstory - I immediately put the book down and went to read about chestnuts being wiped out in droves.
There is no better way to dig deep into the effects of modern technology on society than to read Richard Powers. It is no exaggeration to say that reading Powers fundamentally changed the course of my life. Reading his work is absolutely worth your time.
Re: The demise and potential revival of the American chestnut
#67It seems the pigeons ate the nuts, and the also plummeted in numbers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_chestnut
Re: The demise and potential revival of the American chestnut
#68Earlier quoted context omitted.
> But I would not cry if the biting mosquito that spreads disease, the bacteria that causes wet dog smell, and Cryphonectria parasitica went extinct never to appear again. Remember when Mao tried that with evil evil sparrows stealing seeds from the party and caused the greatest famine in human history? Fun times. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Pests_Campaign
Is there consensus on how significant the sparrow thing was to the famine? I would have guessed that the whole “you’re not allowed to have your own farms any more, you now have to work in these farms, but you don’t get to keep any of the food from these farms” thing was a much more significant cause.
[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Chinese_Famine#Causes_...
Re: The demise and potential revival of the American chestnut
#69I recently bought a house in a wooded area. In the backyard was a large old tree that I could not identify. After much searching I figured out that it was a chestnut tree! The article says they are the "perfect tree", but the chestnuts are incredibly sharp and tough. Very painful to step on.
Green spiny balls of death with nuts inside? That's a Chinese chestnut if so, we have two or three on our property. Deer love them but I'm not a huge fan.
Re: The demise and potential revival of the American chestnut
#70Earlier quoted context omitted.
> But I would not cry if the biting mosquito that spreads disease, the bacteria that causes wet dog smell, and Cryphonectria parasitica went extinct never to appear again. Remember when Mao tried that with evil evil sparrows stealing seeds from the party and caused the greatest famine in human history? Fun times. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Pests_Campaign
Is there consensus on how significant the sparrow thing was to the famine? I would have guessed that the whole “you’re not allowed to have your own farms any more, you now have to work in these farms, but you don’t get to keep any of the food from these farms” thing was a much more significant cause.