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Kinto: Mac-style shortcut keys for Linux and Windows

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Re: Kinto: Mac-style shortcut keys for Linux and Windows

#221

Post by glsdfgkjsklfj »

kristofferR wrote: post #183
alisonatwork wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hear, hear. Alt-Tab is abysmal on Mac. I have no idea why people keep going on about Ctrl-C in the terminal, as if we haven't had terminals on both Windows and UNIX that copy-on-select for 20+ years. Broken Alt-Tab is far bigger impediment to my workflow. I guess you have tried Karabiner-Elements[0] to help remap the keyboard? It's infuriating that it doesn't work properly in all the apps. Especially the browsers all…

https://alt-tab-macos.netlify.app/

There are DOZEN of those apps. The one i use/contribute is https://github.com/numist/Switch

OSX is like using windows in the 90s. You need a dozen weird apps for basic stuff.

iterm2 still steal Option-tab on all of them.

and replacing command-tab breaks in other apps.

There's no solution other than to suffer it.

Re: Kinto: Mac-style shortcut keys for Linux and Windows

#222

Post by michaelmrose »

chrisseaton wrote: post #39
beloch wrote: post #12

The difference between Mac and PC keyboards is a real usability problem. If you're used to PC's or Linux, moving to a Mac and dealing with their shortcuts is painful, and vice-versa. The worst is using a mixture of both Mac's and PC's on a daily basis. Moving back and forth between platforms daily means you either have to get used to hitting the wrong shortcuts or use a hack to swap keys around on one platform so you…

This is why I don't bother investing too much time learning 'shortcuts' in the first place - it's a false economy.

How long can you work on making a routine task more efficient before your spending more time than you save across 5 years.

https://xkcd.com/1205/

5 seconds 5 times a day is 12 hours

By 50 times a day you are spending 5 whole days.

Seems objectively worthwhile.

Re: Kinto: Mac-style shortcut keys for Linux and Windows

#223

Post by SeanLuke »

quesera wrote: post #86
SeanLuke wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, the Mac's keys are derived from the Lisa , whose release well predates the Apple IIe (the first II with the apple keys). Except for the numeric keypad, the Lisa keyboard differed from the Mac only in that the Lisa used an Apple symbol whereas the Mac used ⌘.

I remembered that the Mac Plus (1986) had ⌘, and that the //e and //c both had Open/Closed Apple keys, but wasn't sure about the transition through Lisa and the original Mac. Wikipedia has both the //e and the Lisa with a release date of January 1983. But of course the Lisa project goes way back!

Hmmm, I seem to recall the //e being released much later in 1983. But yeah, maybe they were co-released.

Re: Kinto: Mac-style shortcut keys for Linux and Windows

#224

Post by breakfastduck »

rbreaves wrote: post #84
breakfastduck wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My main computer is a mac but I have to remote into windows machines often and switching between is horrible. I've remapped my gaming pc to mirror the mac layout because the instinct is so much stronger than whats written on the keys.

I have done pretty extensive testing, but I can confirm that my Kinto app does work with your type of configuration. The RDP applications that work is mentioned in the readme.

Amazing. I can install applications (thankfully) on the RDP instance I connect to, so I shall definitely give it a whirl.

Re: Kinto: Mac-style shortcut keys for Linux and Windows

#225

Post by georgn »

Cyph0n wrote: post #94

On a slightly related note: does anyone else map caps lock to control (and vice-versa)? I’ve never really understood why caps lock gets a huge key in the middle of the keyboard, while control gets a regular-sized key at the bottom. Generally speaking, caps lock is used much less than control.

Yes. As a long time Emacs user I do that routinely on _every_ machine I use.

For those that don't know, there are a handful of control key sequences that perform basic cursor movements that are the same in Emacs, bash, zsh, and every text pane in Mac apps. Using caps lock as a control key makes this very pleasant.

I am unlikely to give up this habit since I despise moving my hands from the home row to use arrow keys -- for me, this is the main pain point when switching between Windows and Mac several times per day.

Re: Kinto: Mac-style shortcut keys for Linux and Windows

#226

Post by ungamedplayer »

kergonath wrote: post #126
beloch wrote: post #12

The difference between Mac and PC keyboards is a real usability problem. If you're used to PC's or Linux, moving to a Mac and dealing with their shortcuts is painful, and vice-versa. The worst is using a mixture of both Mac's and PC's on a daily basis. Moving back and forth between platforms daily means you either have to get used to hitting the wrong shortcuts or use a hack to swap keys around on one platform so you…

> The PC and Linux worlds are not going to adopt Mac keyboard layouts. And that’s a damn shame, because they make much more sense. > As the one oddball computer manufacturer that uses their own layout, perhaps it's time for Apple to offer PC keyboard layouts as an option on their machines out of consideration for people who have to use multiple platforms. Lol no. I use Linux, Windows and macOS each about a third of t…

> the last thing I would want is my Mac at home getting significantly worse just to reach the lowest common denominator

Yeah, then what would mac have going for it ?

Re: Kinto: Mac-style shortcut keys for Linux and Windows

#227

Post by mokanfar »

desmap wrote: post #203
mokanfar wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Capslock is dual-role for me, tap for Enter, hold for acting like a custom modifier. Shift is tap for escape, hold for normal shift, tilde is backspace, my pinky gets busy. The best Ctrl replacement is spacebar, the only windows program that does it flawlessy is touchcursor

i had space when pressed remapped with ahk but couldn't get it to work reliably typing above 80wpm, how is it with touch cursor?

I can type 100+ wpm reliably with touch cursor. AHK is not recommended for space bar dual role functionality for the reasons you mentioned.

Re: Kinto: Mac-style shortcut keys for Linux and Windows

#228

Post by rbreaves »

francislavoie wrote: post #148
rubyn00bie wrote: post #55

This is great, btw. Kinto is 100% a sanity saver. Please note the following rant is mostly tongue-in-cheek. 'cuz it turns out, I personally hate how Windows and Linux do things with `ctrl`. Coming from a Mac, my biggest and most consistent annoyance is that the `ctrl` key is fucking useless at best... One of the most common use cases for the `ctrl` key is COPYING shit and followed by PASTING shit and it DOES NOT WORK…

I just solve that terminal issue by using a terminal that has "smart copy". The two I know of that do are pantheon-terminal (from elementaryOS) and kitty. The idea is that Ctrl+C behaves normally (sends SIGINT) unless you have text selected, in which case it will copy the selected text then clear the selection. So if you had something selected, you just hit Ctrl+C twice to send an interrupt if you need to, with the c…

With Kinto I really don’t care which terminal you use, new or outdated - it’ll work the same as they do on a Mac.

Also eOS implementation has its issues, smart copy needs to be disabled too for Kinto to work - thankfully it’s practically the only one.

Re: Kinto: Mac-style shortcut keys for Linux and Windows

#229

Post by thefunnyman »

klodolph wrote: post #164
beloch wrote: post #12

The difference between Mac and PC keyboards is a real usability problem. If you're used to PC's or Linux, moving to a Mac and dealing with their shortcuts is painful, and vice-versa. The worst is using a mixture of both Mac's and PC's on a daily basis. Moving back and forth between platforms daily means you either have to get used to hitting the wrong shortcuts or use a hack to swap keys around on one platform so you…

> The PC and Linux worlds are not going to adopt Mac keyboard layouts. As the one oddball computer manufacturer that uses their own layout, perhaps it's time for Apple to offer PC keyboard layouts as an option on their machines out of consideration for people who have to use multiple platforms. I switch between Mac, Linux, and Windows. The Mac is the only one with a usable, consistent terminal. Linux and Windows both…

I absolutely agree. I work on a Mac but have to remote into a windows machine daily and this still trips me up. The Microsoft Remote Desktop app had the option to keep some Mac shortcuts for copy paste and such but it’s still an absolute usability nightmare.

I used windows machines an overwhelming majority of my life but I find the Mac OS shortcuts to just be much easier to remember and reach with one hand. For example cmd Q for quit as opposed to alt f4 just makes sense.

Re: Kinto: Mac-style shortcut keys for Linux and Windows

#230

Post by silon42 »

rubyn00bie wrote: post #55

This is great, btw. Kinto is 100% a sanity saver. Please note the following rant is mostly tongue-in-cheek. 'cuz it turns out, I personally hate how Windows and Linux do things with `ctrl`. Coming from a Mac, my biggest and most consistent annoyance is that the `ctrl` key is fucking useless at best... One of the most common use cases for the `ctrl` key is COPYING shit and followed by PASTING shit and it DOES NOT WORK…

The conflict between Ctrl+C Copy vs SIGINTR could be resolved by making the Escape key be the interrupt key which would actually be the correct behavior from user standpoint... but everyone would have to relearn it.
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