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Google’s approach to Black schools explains why there's few Black engs in Tech

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Re: Google’s approach to Black schools explains why there's few Black engs in Tech

#41

Post by runawaybottle »

MeinBlutIstBlau wrote: post #12
ForHackernews wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The idea that Google can fix "racial diversity in tech" is absurd at best. These are deeply rooted systemic issues that need to be addressed from the ground up. I don't disagree with the substance of your comment, but it's worth pointing out that Alphabet is a company with a $1,416,000,000,000 market cap. If any non-governmental entity could be said to have the resources to address "systemic issues" at the root, it…

I think the number one detractor to black neighborhoods from engaging in CS is more of a cultural thing. The same reason why women in tech is still pretty low is also the same reason black people in tech is low. The culture tied to their race/sex in the immediate area tends to sway their futures. If dealing drugs or just dropping out is the norm among your friends, it's gonna be very hard for one to just pick up CS a…

Or that it’s a hard major. This isn’t particularly unique to black people. Most students avoid the hard majors in college (even white people, there’s a reason why every bootcamper majored in like the Trombone or Classics in college, because, well, shockingly, they also avoided the hard majors.)

The reason Asian kids don’t avoid it is because of how seriously their parents take their education. You guys want to fix the pipeline problem, talk to Asian fucking parents and learn something.

Re: Google’s approach to Black schools explains why there's few Black engs in Tech

#42

Post by tobobo »

ibn_khaldun wrote: post #9
Traster wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry I’m trying to understand, the only people to care about black people are black people- but a political organisation formed by black people to advocate for black people.... is not going to care about black people?

"All skin folk, ain't kin folk" Black Lives Matter has been on the national stage for almost 6(!) years and has accumulated hundreds of millions of dollars, affecting zero change or influence in Black communities. A film was recently released about Fred Hampton of the Black Panther Party (strangely enough, from what I gather, glorifying the man who coordinated his assassination). I bring this up to say, millions of d…

If you’d like to learn more about what the Black Lives Matter organization worked on last year, you can see their 2020 impact report, including some impressive voter turnout results [1]

If you’re interested specifically in organizations that make breakfast, there are organizations like People’s Breakfast Oakland, which does great work. Not sure if they do omelettes though. [2]

[1] https://blacklivesmatter.com/2020-impact-report/

[2] https://www.hellablackpod.com/pbo

Re: Google’s approach to Black schools explains why there's few Black engs in Tech

#43

Post by mazelife »

eric4smith wrote: post #3
Karsteski wrote: post #2

I'm getting quite tired of all this grandstanding by tech companies that routinely perform highly immoral business practices. Google does not give a fuck about black people. They only care about their public image, which is degrading day by day. The idea that Google can fix "racial diversity in tech" is absurd at best. These are deeply rooted systemic issues that need to be addressed from the ground up. No amount of…

The only people who can give a french toast about black people are black people. It's not going to be: Google, Facebook, etc The Government (tm) SJW's, BLM, etc. And certainly not people on HN The fact is, it's 2021 and people should care about what they do with their themselves, their family and their community first. And stop waiting for [... some other entity ...] to fix their problems.

“Black Lives Matter's Effect on Police Lethal Use-of-Force”

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3767097

Give it a read, maybe it will change your mind. Organizations like BLM were formed to organize concerted protest and political pressure at a community-wide level. That is to say, it’s a direct result of people doing what you suggest they do: “people should care about what they do with themselves, their family, and their community first.”

Re: Google’s approach to Black schools explains why there's few Black engs in Tech

#44

Post by endisneigh »

yostrovs wrote: post #38
endisneigh wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assume you would also be hesitant to hire someone who went to a school like Wellesley then, as well?

Indeed I would.

pretty dumb IMHO - just interview people normally. no use in discriminating against entire schools.

Re: Google’s approach to Black schools explains why there's few Black engs in Tech

#45

Post by [deleted] »

yostrovs wrote: post #14
rayiner wrote: post #11

Some more context: https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/31/business/google-hbcus/index.h... . The allegations about Google discriminating against graduates of HBCUs are deeply troubling. For historical, cultural, and political reasons, HBCU’s are a cornerstone of both economic mobility for lower income Black people, as well as the maintenance of economic and social capital among upper income Black people: https://cmsi.gse.rut…

I would probably be hesitant to hire someone from an HBCU because I would think that being immersed in an environment of only certain kind of persons makes you ill adapted to deal with the variety you'll find in the wider world. Also, when an institution defines itself by some characteristic like color, to me it signals that academics is not its primary concern. HBCUs had an important purpose at one time, but today b…

[deleted]

Re: Google’s approach to Black schools explains why there's few Black engs in Tech

#46

Post by scruple »

Karsteski wrote: post #2

I'm getting quite tired of all this grandstanding by tech companies that routinely perform highly immoral business practices. Google does not give a fuck about black people. They only care about their public image, which is degrading day by day. The idea that Google can fix "racial diversity in tech" is absurd at best. These are deeply rooted systemic issues that need to be addressed from the ground up. No amount of…

> Google does not give a fuck about black people.

They care about them so long as the posturing that they engage with can make them money.

In my opinion, they get away with this because the word equality, when they say that they "care" about "equality," no longer has any attachment to class consciousness.

Amazon does this right in front of our faces. Nike and Apple do it but you have to peek behind the curtain a bit. Google, as well, but now you really have to dig, hence this article.

Re: Google’s approach to Black schools explains why there's few Black engs in Tech

#47

Post by rayiner »

whoknew1122 wrote: post #34
eric4smith wrote: post #18

Why are we expecting these companies (or anyone) to fix all problems. The fix is simple. Focus on your own home and yourself first. Teach your kids more at home. Be more involved with them. Teach them to take responsibility. Don’t do silly degrees that cost huge student loans. Do more STEM. Start a small business. Eat better food. Exercise. Sure there is systemic stuff out there - but it’s 2021 and you have a choice…

> "Teach your kids more at home. Be more involved with them. Teach them to take responsibility. Don’t do silly degrees that cost huge student loans. Do more STEM. Start a small business. Eat better food. Exercise." Wow, I'm glad you have the program down for all the low income people. Why don't they pick themselves up by their bootstraps (which, incidentally, is physically impossible). > Teach kids at home Assumes yo…

We are talking about Black representation at Google. Why are you both acting like this conversation is about “low income people” who “ride bicycles to work to make barely above minimum wage?”

Among people in the top 20% of income ages 40-50 (a reasonable proxy for the households where most Google employees grew up), 7% are Black compared to 12% of the overall population that is Black. It’s ignorant to turn every issue involving Black people into a discussion of inner city poverty. (And especially ignorant in the context of discussing HBCUs, as in this article, which are a pillar of the Black upper middle class.)

Re: Google’s approach to Black schools explains why there's few Black engs in Tech

#48

Post by whoknew1122 »

rayiner wrote: post #47
whoknew1122 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "Teach your kids more at home. Be more involved with them. Teach them to take responsibility. Don’t do silly degrees that cost huge student loans. Do more STEM. Start a small business. Eat better food. Exercise." Wow, I'm glad you have the program down for all the low income people. Why don't they pick themselves up by their bootstraps (which, incidentally, is physically impossible). > Teach kids at home Assumes yo…

We are talking about Black representation at Google. Why are you both acting like this conversation is about “low income people” who “ride bicycles to work to make barely above minimum wage?” Among people in the top 20% of income ages 40-50 (a reasonable proxy for the households where most Google employees grew up), 7% are Black compared to 12% of the overall population that is Black. It’s ignorant to turn every issu…

> "Why are you both acting like this conversation is about 'low income people' who 'ride bicycles to work to make barely above minimum wage?'"

Because HBCUs are a gateway to the middle class for many low income people who come from generational poverty? It's an outlet for many first-time college students and those scraping toward the middle class.

And the 'ride bicycles to work to make barely above minimum wage' is from both personal experience and the fact that the generationally poor are largely dependant on forms of transportation other than personal vehicles.

> "It’s ignorant to turn every issue involving Black people into a discussion of inner city poverty. (And especially ignorant in the context of discussing HBCUs, as in this article, which are a pillar of the Black upper middle class.)"

HBCUs are a pillar of the Black upper middle class, but the majority of students are still lower-income. So it's relevant to talk about low-income students.[1][2][3]

[1] https://cmsi.gse.rutgers.edu/sites/default/files/EMreport_R4... (p. 11) [2] https://www.insidehighered.com/quicktakes/2019/10/01/more-ec... [3] https://archive.is/swhoh

Re: Google’s approach to Black schools explains why there's few Black engs in Tech

#49

Post by Dma54rhs »

mazelife wrote: post #43
eric4smith wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only people who can give a french toast about black people are black people. It's not going to be: Google, Facebook, etc The Government (tm) SJW's, BLM, etc. And certainly not people on HN The fact is, it's 2021 and people should care about what they do with their themselves, their family and their community first. And stop waiting for [... some other entity ...] to fix their problems.

“Black Lives Matter's Effect on Police Lethal Use-of-Force” https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3767097 Give it a read, maybe it will change your mind. Organizations like BLM were formed to organize concerted protest and political pressure at a community-wide level. That is to say, it’s a direct result of people doing what you suggest they do: “people should care about what they do with themselves, th…

BLM is a tool for Russians, as one can read from Muellers report their social media was ran by them.

Re: Google’s approach to Black schools explains why there's few Black engs in Tech

#50

Post by tptacek »

yostrovs wrote: post #26
rayiner wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I quite disagree, but it’s fair to say that the issue of how to close gaps between Black and white people is a complicated one with no clear answers. What’s more important here is that lots of affluent Black people disagree with you—and therefore attend and send their kids to HBCUs. If Google, etc., want to recruit more Black people, the answer can’t be to overlook HBCUs based on conclusions about whether “they remai…

Companies like Google can afford to hire the best. They do that by getting people from top end CS schools like Stanford, CMU, Berkeley and other relevant schools for non CS work. HBCUs are simply not in the top tier and don't produce developers that will be worth $200,000 a year. It's not because they're black colleges but because they're not in the top 1 percent.

"HBCUs don't produce developers that will be worth $200,000 a year"? I know high school dropouts who are worth more than that. What a strange statement.
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