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Chinese hacking spree hit an ‘astronomical’ number of victims

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Re: Chinese hacking spree hit an ‘astronomical’ number of victims

#51

Post by loceng »

solosoyokaze wrote: post #8

Where is the proof that this was a Chinese hacking group? I certainly don't trust Microsoft to provide it. In fact, it's very concerning that Microsoft seems to be in some quasi-governmental role in this. It's literally a giant security hole in their software, why should we trust what they say? The White House acting as a PR unit for MS (or is it vice versa?) is a serious problem.

How are we to trust you're not a paid Putin or CCP propagandist? Arguably Microsoft has far more credibility than you - my point being there are ways people orient for trusting individuals and organizations.

If you think the current White House administration and Microsoft aren't on the more trustworthy side of the trust spectrum, then who in your opinion is more trustworthy?

Re: Chinese hacking spree hit an ‘astronomical’ number of victims

#52

Post by e40 »

yumraj wrote: post #4

We need two things, I don’t think either will happen: 1) sanctions against China 2) a Greater Firewall outside China, right on all fiber cables, blocking/filtering all traffic from China. China is a hostile nation and we need to treat it as such.

I love the world we live in: everyone has an opinion on severely complex matters and proffers it in an absolutely confident way that their opinion is the truth.

I don't like China's behavior (toward us and it's own). I don't believe for a minute that I know how to solve the problem, because every solution is bound to have unintended side effects, some which may be worse than the original problem.

Re: Chinese hacking spree hit an ‘astronomical’ number of victims

#53

Post by kelnos »

refenestrator wrote: post #10
bushbaba wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The us let’s Chinese firms generally speaking full access to the us market. The CCP doesn’t allow the us companies the same. Why our government let that happen. Letting so much business leave to the CCP will be one of the greatest failings of the us government.

Because we're arrogant. We thought that if we go down the road we went down, they'd naturally settle into their proper place as manufactory for the West without wanting a seat at the table. Now they're a global power and, gasp, they act like one. Nobody could have seen this coming.

The US also believed that giving China an example of "the good way" via access to the US markets would cause them to open up and allow access in kind. Turned out that was a pretty naive belief.

Re: Chinese hacking spree hit an ‘astronomical’ number of victims

#54

Post by emteycz »

ahelwer wrote: post #44
Rebelgecko wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why exclude WW2?

I'm assuming you're saying this because you want to compare China to Nazi Germany, which is strange when the USSR is a much more apt comparison that existed in the postwar period.

Why do you think so? China is acting very much like Nazis in many cases. That they both call themselves communists doesn't mean much, actions matter.

Re: Chinese hacking spree hit an ‘astronomical’ number of victims

#55

Post by throwawaybumeer »

ahelwer wrote: post #36
Rebelgecko wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The status quo also leads to suffering and death in the civilian population and it's hard to predict which future would be worse

Actually it's quite easy to predict! We can simply look at the track record of Western intervention since WW2, see that it comes down so squarely on the side of "please USA just leave the world alone, my god" that it achieves the platonic definition of a square, then call it a day.

I wonder if Disjunctive Consulting would appreciate you working for them knowing how much you hate the US. Why not just move back to Canada?

Re: Chinese hacking spree hit an ‘astronomical’ number of victims

#56

Post by Aunche »

Rebelgecko wrote: post #34
ahelwer wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sanctions lead to widespread suffering & even death among the civilian population. Why do you want the Chinese people to suffer or die? Sanctions are scarcely less psychotic than bombing a school or hospital. The violence is just hidden in life expectancy reduction & many other metrics instead of "N civilians' bodies ripped apart by bombs". Oh, and targeted sanctions - aren't. Entities will view any sanctions as a le…

The status quo also leads to suffering and death in the civilian population and it's hard to predict which future would be worse

Has more suffering and death occurred in China before or after China opened up to the rest of the world? If they remained closed off to this day, they would much more closely resemble North Korea.

Re: Chinese hacking spree hit an ‘astronomical’ number of victims

#57

Post by alacombe »

ahelwer wrote: post #16
yumraj wrote: post #4

We need two things, I don’t think either will happen: 1) sanctions against China 2) a Greater Firewall outside China, right on all fiber cables, blocking/filtering all traffic from China. China is a hostile nation and we need to treat it as such.

Sanctions lead to widespread suffering & even death among the civilian population. Why do you want the Chinese people to suffer or die? Sanctions are scarcely less psychotic than bombing a school or hospital. The violence is just hidden in life expectancy reduction & many other metrics instead of "N civilians' bodies ripped apart by bombs". Oh, and targeted sanctions - aren't. Entities will view any sanctions as a le…

> Sanctions lead to widespread suffering & even death among the civilian population

So does doing nothing.

Re: Chinese hacking spree hit an ‘astronomical’ number of victims

#58

Post by Rebelgecko »

ahelwer wrote: post #44
Rebelgecko wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why exclude WW2?

I'm assuming you're saying this because you want to compare China to Nazi Germany, which is strange when the USSR is a much more apt comparison that existed in the postwar period.

I'm just curious about people's reasoning whenever they cherrypick arbitrary start/end dates

Re: Chinese hacking spree hit an ‘astronomical’ number of victims

#59

Post by alacombe »

Aunche wrote: post #56
Rebelgecko wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The status quo also leads to suffering and death in the civilian population and it's hard to predict which future would be worse

Has more suffering and death occurred in China before or after China opened up to the rest of the world? If they remained closed off to this day, they would much more closely resemble North Korea.

Before, for sure, Mao policies were pretty ruthless.

Re: Chinese hacking spree hit an ‘astronomical’ number of victims

#60

Post by AnimalMuppet »

mc32 wrote: post #33
Aunche wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US has a significantly larger consumer market. A lot of people would complain if they were unable to import cheap goods from China.

Yeah but it means they don’t get paid as much either as there is no wage pressure at the bottom. You can’t have $5 T-shirts and also a $15 minimum wage.

You can’t have $5 T-shirts and also a $15 minimum wage and low unemployment. You can have $5 T-shirts and a $15 minimum wage and no jobs, but nobody actually wants that outcome.
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