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Gab has been hacked and 70GB of data leaked

arstechnica.com

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Re: Gab has been hacked and 70GB of data leaked

#821

Post by totalZero »

marknutter wrote: post #780
totalZero wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are forgetting the word "purely." If some fascist incites people to riot and innocent police officers get killed (hypothetical example), then there are strong political reasons to put the perpetrators behind bars for their crimes. Law and order is a political issue. Protection of institutions is a political issue. The First Amendment doesn't say you can incite a riot as long as it is a political riot. That a crim…

Do you understand how high the bar is for a conviction in an incitement case?

Surely you don't believe that the only politically motivated crimes are cases of incitement...yet I think you're a bit off track anyway, for a different reason.

> In a so-called liberal state we shouldn't send people behind bars for political reasons, not even fascists

Note the "shouldn't" -- even if your point were valid, it's moot because this is a conversation about "should" not "do."

Gitlow v. New York upheld conviction based on a loose interpretation of "clear and present danger," and later Feiner v. New York held that the police can take action against speech when there is a clear and present danger. But again, none of that matters because we're not debating legal theory, nor implementation of law.

Are you suggesting that we should pardon all criminals who are motivated in part or in whole by political reasons?

Re: Gab has been hacked and 70GB of data leaked

#822

Post by x86_64Ubuntu »

jejones3141 wrote: post #818
x86_64Ubuntu wrote: post #561

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not even close. No one was talking about Obama splitting the party and seeking revenge against ideological bedfellows after serving only one term.

From Merriam-Webster: "a situation in which a public figure (such as a political leader) is deliberately presented to the people of a country as a great person who should be admired and loved". Wikipedia mentions the use of mass media, propaganda, spectacle, etc. "to create an idealized, heroic, and worshipful image of a leader, often through unquestioning flattery and praise". I see nothing there about splitting the…

None of those videos are par for the course concerning how the Left views Obama.

Re: Gab has been hacked and 70GB of data leaked

#823

Post by young_unixer »

jordigh wrote: post #785
young_unixer wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you, but Twitter is rife with leftists being almost as horrible as Gab's extremists and not getting banned because Twitter execs lean left. So let's not act like Gab users are the only ones being awful.

Ah yes, false equivalences. However, the current state of affairs is more like far left far right [Overton Window] perceived perceived far left far right Why is "both sides" or "they started it" or "what about" the only other retort that always comes up?

I'd say it's more like this:

    far left          center            far right
    
               [Western O.W.]
                      [US Overton W.]
                             [  Gab users*   ]
     [        Twitter users*       ]
*: 90% of users, because there will always be outliers.

Re: Gab has been hacked and 70GB of data leaked

#824

Post by rbanffy »

sanp wrote: post #660
vinger wrote: post #575

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All of those things apply to most of the population. Maybe a firefighters or a teacher or a policeman should be looked at as a hero before a politician.

S0, what does it say about Republicans when they voted for someone who is worse than most of the population

That someone is worse than most Republicans too.

Re: Gab has been hacked and 70GB of data leaked

#825

Post by flipcoder »

pii wrote: post #361
neilsense wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"fascist" is such an easy word to use without really knowing what it means, slowly degrading its power.

Definition of fascism 1 often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

> forcible suppression of opposition

You mean like... censorship?

Re: Gab has been hacked and 70GB of data leaked

#826

Post by jb775 »

jpgvm wrote: post #308
jb775 wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The real reason is that American tech company execs and most American tech workers are leftists, and leftists try to censor and ignore any political opinion they disagree with (rather than discuss, etc). Since free speech platforms don't censor any content, leftists naturally hate them...and they'll do anything in their power to slow them down. Rather than acknowledge this, they make themselves feel better by claimin…

There is a difference between allowing free speech and allowing hate speech. Free speech: I don't think America should engage in an open immigration policy for reasons X, Y, Z that disadvantage us in A, B, C ways. Hate speech: BUILD THE WALL TO KEEP OUT THE RAPISTS. If you can't see the difference then that is why will get banned from platforms that allow free speech but ban hate speech.

I don't consider your example of hate speech to be anything close to actual hate speech. I consider your example to be an example of an ignorant and un-intelligent statement.

This is a perfect example of two major issues going on:

1) America is catering to the lowest common denominator of who is offended and therefore creating a race to the bottom for societal norms (i.e. you considering your example to be hate speech, but I don't...but society currently feels the need to make sure you feel comfortable in your safe place)

2) 95% of the platform discussion may be in the form of your "Free speech" example, but if there's any occurrence of your "Hate speech" example, the entire platform is labeled a "Hate speech" platform....and this feeds back into issue #1

Re: Gab has been hacked and 70GB of data leaked

#827

Post by leereeves »

UncleMeat wrote: post #451
leereeves wrote: post #405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think it is generally understood that Hitler's entrance into the National Socialists marked a deviation from Socialist ideas. No, the 25 point plan was announced by Hitler in 1920, including all of those socialist ideas. And the night of the long knives was in 1934. For over 14 years, socialists like Strasser were an important part of the Nazi party, working side by side with Hitler. Then Hitler consolidated powe…

Yeah and the really really bad part that we all remember the nazis for took place after hitler rose to power and all the socialists in the party were murdered. When people say “the nazis were socialist” they are trying to draw a line from the modern left to genocide. But this is just not a functioning argument.

I'm not trying to draw a line from the modern left to genocide. But I don't agree with refusing to acknowledge historical facts for fear someone might draw that line.

Re: Gab has been hacked and 70GB of data leaked

#828

Post by nailer »

ggggtez wrote: post #786
nailer wrote: post #759

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Citation needed. Likewise. Can you name a single high profile twitter ban that was due to promotion of white supremacy, sexism, or similar? > But honestly, it doesn't matter because it doesn't change the fact that this is the libertarian ideal situation. Monopolies are not free markets.

Twitter isn't a monopoly, now you're just being silly. > Can you name a single high profile twitter ban that was due to promotion of white supremacy, sexism, or similar? Since you only asked for one, I'll give you probably the most clear cut example that can be asked for: David Duke, well known former KKK grand wizard. https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-53608106 There you go, now you have one. If you want more, I'm…

Twitter isn’t a monopoly? What’s the other popular social network where political discussion happens?

You coming up with David Duke as an example of a controversial ban is an excellent example of my argument. Was this considered controversial? Who supported Duke remaining on Twitter?

Re: Gab has been hacked and 70GB of data leaked

#829

Post by kodah »

throw_away892 wrote: post #752
kodah wrote: post #645

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're called guidelines not rules or commandments. People violate them all the time and get away with it and I'm pretty sure that's why they're called guidelines. There's one person moderating here and that's dang. I've had plenty of pushback for both the left and the right I've got no shortage of karma.

Kinda new on here but am loving the bare bones feel to the forum. The karma bit in my previous comment was added as a sarcastic aid. I personally don't care much for gaining karma. Thank you for this extra context. Very helpful.

It's the last place where curiosity is not only allowed but encouraged to flourish. It's a special place. I figured you were joking but there's been a lot of green handles around lately and they may not get it. I hear there can be a massive culture shock coming to HackerNews so sometimes calling out the obvious can be helpful.

Get yourself a real handle and join the community officially!

Re: Gab has been hacked and 70GB of data leaked

#830

Post by jpgvm »

jb775 wrote: post #826
jpgvm wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a difference between allowing free speech and allowing hate speech. Free speech: I don't think America should engage in an open immigration policy for reasons X, Y, Z that disadvantage us in A, B, C ways. Hate speech: BUILD THE WALL TO KEEP OUT THE RAPISTS. If you can't see the difference then that is why will get banned from platforms that allow free speech but ban hate speech.

I don't consider your example of hate speech to be anything close to actual hate speech . I consider your example to be an example of an ignorant and un-intelligent statement. This is a perfect example of two major issues going on: 1) America is catering to the lowest common denominator of who is offended and therefore creating a race to the bottom for societal norms (i.e. you considering your example to be hate spee…

I don't know how implying an entire country of people are rapists isn't hate speech but ok. At the very least it's racist and intolerant which has no place in public discourse.

I do agree with 1. America goes too far to cater for people having "safe spaces". This cuts both ways though though and I would say the American right go much further to create and enforce safe spaces where their views won't be challenged. (r/conservative and TD before that).

2. I don't think this is true at all. Reddit definitely has its share of hate speech and nonsense but it's not considered a hate speech platform. It's only when the overwhelming majority of content is hateful garbage that you get to that point. Gab/Parlor being the 2 main current examples.

To me your argument is like many others, trying to find a way to excuse hateful, racist, homophobic nonsense as "free speech" as if in some way this speech should be protected because it provides some value to society (it doesn't).

Many also argue it's a bias against conservatism but that isn't true either. Conservatism isn't meant to be any of those things and if they could drop all of that they might find people much more receptive to their ideas.

There are constructive ways to push conservative views, I myself would measure myself as a centrist. I see both sides of many arguments but I am definitely tired of the right wing rhetoric. Just because I think fiscal conservatism is a good idea and small-ish government can be a good thing in certain areas doesn't mean I should need to read/tolerate all the crap currently being pedled.

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