Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

On the Experience of Being Poor-Ish, for People Who Aren't

residentcontrarian.substack.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

581–590 of 920 posts

Re: On the Experience of Being Poor-Ish, for People Who Aren't

#581

Post by dalbasal »

aidenn0 wrote: post #562
dalbasal wrote: post #303

His point on housing is so important, and its adjacent to a lot of other poverty-related issues. It's one of the reasons advocates for the poor often seem to speak a different language to their opposition. If you live in median-and-above-land, you think of all costs existing on a spectrum. Fancy dinners for $100 on one end. Rice and beans for pennies at the other. This is true for clothes, smartphones, furniture... l…

Healthcare and housing are two things that seem to crush those in poverty (with transportation being a distant, but important, third. On one hand you can keep a job with no house, but can't with no transportation; on the other hand, cars have gotten cheaper and more reliable pretty steadily over my lifetime). A lot of families are a single injury to a non earner away from being bankrupt. Obviously an injury to an ear…

Maybe in the states this is true about transport. Here in ireland I would guesstimate the difference between entry level (personal car) ownership costs and upper-middle class car ownership at 1/1.5... maybe even less... maybe even negative.

Fuel costs, registration and insurance costs are, I'd wager, negatively correlated with wealth and much higher here than the states. Driving an older car can cost €100-€200 more per month than a new one.

Re: On the Experience of Being Poor-Ish, for People Who Aren't

#582

Post by criticaljudge »

sbarre wrote: post #409
TrackerFF wrote: post #374

I think the biggest threat to poor people, would be the ridiculous housing market. It's not just in big expensive cities, it's pretty much everywhere. Only places that are being spared, are those in destitute areas with some serious emigration problems - but those things happen for a reason (no work). In my country (Norway), the housing market has appreciated around 5.5% ANNUALLY, compared to annual wage increase of…

> I think the biggest threat to poor people, would be the ridiculous housing market. I have heard this referred to as the "financialization of housing" in articles I've read over the last few years. Google that term to find out more.. Basically more and more multinational corporations (structured as REITs and similar) have turned their eyes towards the housing market, buying up stock in major cities and wherever ther…

You can't arbitrarily set rent prices. You can only ask what people are also willing to pay.

People are willing to pay because they have high paying jobs and want to live near to where they work. And that is ultimately also a good thing.

Think about a brain surgeon, who under socialism would have to commute for two hours to his jobs, and under evil capitalism can live 20 minutes from the hospital. Under capitalism he will get to the job well rested and therefore have a higher success rate for his operations.

Re: On the Experience of Being Poor-Ish, for People Who Aren't

#583

Post by grumple »

nitrogen wrote: post #335
grumple wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a similar story and luck played no part of it. I spent lots of time in public libraries and on public computers as a kid. As a result, I got an academic scholarship. A few years after graduating amidst the 2008 economic crisis, I heard about a company that used a particular programming language. I learned that language and convinced someone I knew at the company to get me an interview. I aced the interview and…

someone I knew at the company Sounds fortunate. This is one aspect where I too have been "lucky" in the past, but you have to be both lucky and good.

I think the key is looking at the opportunities that you have, whatever they may be, and putting in the work to take advantage of them. I have hundreds of friends who are relatively poor and who have many opportunities they don’t take. For example, I’ve offered to give free guidance or instruction to many, but it turns out most people don’t want to take advantage of that. I told people I could hire them (into the very same role I first had), but they didn’t recognize the opportunity. People want easy, so they ignore opportunities like this in their lives.

Re: On the Experience of Being Poor-Ish, for People Who Aren't

#584

Post by EvilEy3 »

xxpor wrote: post #550
criticaljudge wrote: post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think people quickly tire of it when they have to take care of those lazy people directly. I'm not saying nothing should be done. Just that it is a fallacy to think the government simply has infinite money to spend.

> Just that it is a fallacy to think the government simply has infinite money to spend. They create the money so they literally do. Doesn't mean it shouldn't be deployed wisely of course.

They "create" money out of your pocket.

Re: On the Experience of Being Poor-Ish, for People Who Aren't

#585

Post by bozzcl »

busterarm wrote: post #216
throwaway-0987 wrote: post #174

Throwaway because I don't want my co-workers to know. I was poor. My father left home when I was a kid in middle school. My mom worked part time cleaning houses and left us when she found a new husband. I dropped out of high-school in the 9th grade and went to work. Low paying jobs. I lived with my aunt on the bad side of town. Fast-forward 35 years. Today, I make about 200K per year. I got a GED, went to trade schoo…

Fellow former-poor here. It's the kind of thing that casts a shadow over your whole life. And in this industry, nobody is comfortable talking about it. Most of the people I work with graduated from school as guaranteed millionaires. I hear things get said by people that are so far from the orbit of my reality and I cringe. Reading the article was really eye opening for me because I hadn't thought of all of the life s…

> And in this industry, nobody is comfortable talking about it.

Man, I remember some of the business courses I took, as well as the reports and presentations we did after our internships. So many people's thoughts and conclusions read basically as "I learned that the poor are people too". This was at one of the top universities in my home country. It's reasonable to expect these people would be industry leaders eventually. The lack of empathy they showed was appalling.

All that being said, I'm glad you got through the challenges in your early life. I wish we were more tolerant about poorness, because sharing experiences like yours could definitely teach and encourage other kids to fight for a better quality of life. Having more people with your experience in places of power could also help bring a little more empathy to society. We need it badly.

Re: On the Experience of Being Poor-Ish, for People Who Aren't

#586

Post by WalterBright »

acdha wrote: post #168
WalterBright wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always got my security deposit back when I rented. No drama, they just checked the apartment and gave it back.

In the US, there are sharp race and class disparities here: if you’re white and pass for at least lower middle class, you are much less likely to have an issue because even unethical landlords know the police and courts will listen to complaints. Go outside of those communities and complaints become more common, often with accounts of a rental company caving immediately after someone demonstrated knowledge of their l…

> caving immediately after someone demonstrated knowledge of their legal rights and lack of fear to contact the justice system.

Sounds like the solution. When I was younger, people would try to take advantage of me, but all it takes is a bit of standing up for yourself and they concede.

Re: On the Experience of Being Poor-Ish, for People Who Aren't

#587

Post by wizzwizz4 »

killtimeatwork wrote: post #218
wizzwizz4 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Value, not demand. A nurse who helps stop 50 people from dying each week is doing very valuable work, but a talented lawyer helping to defeat valid class-action lawsuits (negative value work) is probably paid more.

You don't even need a nurse - a farmer is preventing multiple people from starving and a cleaner is preventing multiple deaths from parasites and infectious diseases.

True, but those are less direct, so easier to sweep under the rug (cleaner… no pun intended), or dismiss with “but market forces” (farmer).

Re: On the Experience of Being Poor-Ish, for People Who Aren't

#588

Post by whimsicalism »

bradleyjg wrote: post #416
nerdponx wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is very much the trend I saw over the 2000s-2010s. Most of the people in my personal cohort - with university degrees and good careers - have no problem living a good life in the US. But with the rapid inflation of the cost of healthcare, higher education and housing, I wonder how that lifestyle can possibly become accessible to people who weren't essentially born into it. I know many people who were born into a…

> Something fucky is going on, and I doubt it's all because of the "free" market. At first the suburban house as bottomless bank account was a result of “natural” forces like the baby boom and white flight. But people came to assume it, and then demand it. Politicians have obliged since homeowners are an extremely large and powerful demographic. Prior to 2008 we at least pretended to have a private mortgage industry.…

21st century is: we're turning everything into a market, far fewer easy but well-paid jobs, if older people had to actually face the brunt of it they would lose their homes.

People who can't handle technology don't have a chance nowadays.

Re: On the Experience of Being Poor-Ish, for People Who Aren't

#589

Post by hellbannedguy »

criticaljudge wrote: post #512
whimsicalism wrote: post #469

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The government can not and should not lift people out of poverty if those people refuse to work to better themselves. I think everyone is deserving of not living in poverty. Even "lazy" people.

I think people quickly tire of it when they have to take care of those lazy people directly. I'm not saying nothing should be done. Just that it is a fallacy to think the government simply has infinite money to spend.

I don’t think they are lazy.

Many have emotional problems.

Most people complain about their jobs, or multiple jobs, but know it provides so much more than money. Half the people I know would have 0 friends, O social life, if not for those lousy jobs.

It’s ironic you say the government doesn’t have infinite money to spend.

We are about to throw close to two trillion out of a helicopter. There is not a person, well one, on my block in Marin County that has not benefited financially from the virus, but will be getting $1400 to blow.

I am worried about inflation.

Re: On the Experience of Being Poor-Ish, for People Who Aren't

#590

Post by EvilEy3 »

heurist wrote: post #518
dahfizz wrote: post #459

Earlier quoted context omitted.

3 of the 5 factors you list boil down to "OP made good decisions and worked hard". I'm not sure how that is a counter argument to "throwaway-0987 did it, and you can too! You just need to stop being so lazy". From their description, it doesn't sound like living with his Aunt was a tremendous boon either. I don't mean to argue against a social safety net (free college in this example was certainly a good thing). I jus…

You'd throw impoverished and depressed people under the bus because they can't muster the energy to "better" themselves?

Why is it "throw under the bus" or help them?
Post reply on HN