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In Defense of Dumb TVs

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Re: In Defense of Dumb TVs

#371

Post by naikrovek »

rurban wrote: post #312
zapdrive wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Citation needed. There's no evidence that any TV sends this data at boot (and frankly there's no need to, it can send this data later on).

No citation possible, because the data is encrypted. What is measurable is the delayed startup. Of course they can send the data later, but that's not what is measured.

> No citation possible

Then why are you saying something as if it is fact? You don't know what is happening there, you've assumed. You're guessing.

Re: In Defense of Dumb TVs

#372

Post by [deleted] »

TylerE wrote: post #185
ksec wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As much as I want this to happen. And I have been advocating for it [1] for many years. The more I read into the whole TV, display panel and electronic industry the grimmer it is for such Apple TV set to exist. An Apple branded TV, even if it is without the TV part or just a monitor would have to be at least 2-3x the price of today's similar TV sets. And if anything OP were only willing to paid an extra $100 is proba…

The thing is, Apple could charge 2-3x, because the prices have gotten so cheap. People would absolutely pay $1000-1200 for a 55" Apple TV with nice software, and maybe a nice brushed aluminum frame that looks nice on the wall. (For comparison, the cheapest 55" I could quickly find from a major retail is around $300, with a "name brand" starting around $400).

[deleted]

Re: In Defense of Dumb TVs

#373

Post by jannes »

_underfl0w_ wrote: post #336
jannes wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Couldn’t you just change the date back a few years in that case? Why do you need an accurate date on the TV?

How would you change the date if you can't get around the prompt?

Sorry, I missed the part about the dialog being undismissable. I assumed they were talking about a nag screen.

I don’t think a non-dismissable dialog would be legal unless they clearly sold the TV as “Internet connection required”.

Re: In Defense of Dumb TVs

#374

Post by rovr138 »

tombert wrote: post #365
dijit wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some stuff a year ago. It was confirmed by others at the time (after testing) though didn’t seem to get picked up by news outlets. https://www.reddit.com/r/privacy/comments/bpr6xs/if_you_choo... Anecdotally I have 6 Samsung TVs hung on my office wall for monitoring, which run the Tizen OS and the nag screens about connecting to a network and accepting the ToS make the units a little annoying to work with. (But it’s n…

Hmm, weird, I use a 50" Samsung 4k TV as my "monitor" (I'm not much of a gamer so a lower refresh rate is fine for coding and watching YouTube), and I never set up my WiFi and I don't think I accepted any Terms of Service, and it doesn't nag me, but granted literally the only video data that's been displayed on the TV has been an HDMI input and the color-correction menu. Maybe different models of Samsung TVs do thing…

Or firmware versions

Re: In Defense of Dumb TVs

#375

Post by funcDropShadow »

cactus2093 wrote: post #305
wlesieutre wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google is adding a “dumb TV mode,” but I’m skeptical. https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/02/the-best-feature-of-... Presumably will still boot slowly and only the topmost UI layer loads differently, and until they confirm otherwise I’m guessing that even with a simplified UI it still includes all the creepy tracking of everything you watch.

How will they track you though, some sort of real time content id of everything you watch? Is there any evidence that they do this? If it’s in dumb tv mode and the display stream is coming from a separate device like an Apple TV then it seems much less trivial to track you than if you’re using the builtin smart features.

> Is there any evidence that they do this?

Evidence is a high bar. But I can tell you my f...ing smart tv asks me on behalf of tv stations to accept cookies when I switch to some german tv stations. Yes, I'd say they are tracking what I am watching. That is with TV over satellite in Germany.

Re: In Defense of Dumb TVs

#376

Post by [deleted] »

1-6 wrote: post #343
friseurtermin wrote: post #253

I fully agree about dumb TVs for personal use. Even having to wait for your TV's OS to boot up when you turn it on is a terrible UX. However, when it comes to buying a TV for your conference room where you have a TV running 12hrs/day (when you're not a small startup with 10ppl), invest in a proper commercial TV like NEC or (my personal favorite brand) iiyama: 1) the're dumb TVs from the start, 2) you get proper warra…

NEC’s are expensive so it’ll be tougher passing approval at the expense department. This smart TV business has to end, I have a Samsung “The Frame” and it looks a lot like those NEC’s you’re mentioning. In fact, it’s the perfect conference TV. The problem is that when I keep it disconnected from the Internet, I get a message on screen every time I power it off. I’m going to try changing the region to a more internet-…

[deleted]

Re: In Defense of Dumb TVs

#377

Post by gonehome »

SOLAR_FIELDS wrote: post #122
randallsquared wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A remote designed by someone who thought about it for ten seconds I love that a sibling comment to yours calls out the remote as dealbreaker terrible, but I agree with the sentiment that I would love a remote that was really well-designed.

You can go too far in the other direction too, however. Apple TV remote infamously has no mute functionality. And if you do an internet search on how to mute the Apple TV using the remote (because of course there’s a way, right? No one would design a TV remote that has volume control without mute) you get either one of two answers: - it’s impossible/difficult to do with current tech (not true) - the classic Apple for…

I’d probably do something that’s a large dial like an Apple Watch crown for volume that takes up most of a square remote and you push down for mute/unmute.

The other buttons I’d have on it would be power, and input switch.

I’d have an Apple HomePod sound bar which connects to the tv so you don’t have to configure any of that.

Then you’d use the Apple TV remote like normal for everything else. The regular dial remote is just always sitting on the coffee table.

Alternatively they could extend the existing Apple TV remote a bit to add a mute and volume knob or reconfigure to be the one remote for the dumb tv and the Apple TV.

Re: In Defense of Dumb TVs

#378

Post by gonehome »

drewzero1 wrote: post #368
olliej wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally I find the problem with the apple remote to be the symmetric design (I would have though the puck mouse would have taught that lesson)

I had to look up a picture because I didn't realize they'd updated the remote at some point. I apparently have a previous generation remote which has all the controls at one end and is pretty usable in the dark. It's sad (but not shocking) to see design usability regress like that.

New versions of the new design have a raised white circle around the menu button which makes it obvious which side is the top (if you couldn’t tell from feeling the trackpad).

People on HN complain about this a lot, but I’ve used it for years and had parents use it without issue. I think it’s a made up problem.

Re: In Defense of Dumb TVs

#379

Post by ValentineC »

pridkett wrote: post #15

I’m really pleased the author called out the Apple TV as a device that lets you avoid ads. We tried to go cheap on another of our TVs and get an Amazon Fire Stick and in addition to it being not as smooth (combo of UX and speed) at the Apple TV, it had a good amount of ads all over the place. There’s lots of griping about the cost of an Apple TV 4k, but I’ll pay that extra $100 to avoid ads and not be tracked so exte…

> We tried to go cheap on another of our TVs and get an Amazon Fire Stick and in addition to it being not as smooth (combo of UX and speed) at the Apple TV, it had a good amount of ads all over the place.

If we're talking about the original, non-4k Fire TV Stick, then yes. The 4k version is speedy, but still laden with ads.

I recently purchased a Roku Streaming Stick Plus ($39 USD on Amazon — that's ~20% the price of an Apple TV) because I found out that they natively supported AirPlay 2. If you're looking for an ad-free experience, VPN out to an unsupported country and create a Roku account there. You'll be able to add less "channels", but Roku also stops trying to hard-sell you on subscriptions.

Re: In Defense of Dumb TVs

#380

Post by 3guk »

colincooke wrote: post #120

This resonates with me. Recently my Samsung "smart" TV decided that after I turned off an input device, the appropriate behaviour was to immediately display some garbage "entertainment" channel called cheddar. I think it's what is played at gas station pumps? The day that happened is the day my TV lost internet privilages (wifi is turned off) and we started just using a chromecast for all the "smart" functionalities.

Ahhh the joys of Samsung TV Plus - one of the most irritating "features" that they've added to sets in all my years of providing tech support for them.

I've listed a few ways to disable TV plus at : https://factory-reset.com/wiki/Samsung_TV_Plus - without having to disable the other smart features on your set by disabling the internet connection.

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