Earlier quoted context omitted.
> money With built in and inevitable deflation. Bitcoin could never replace a national currency. With transaction times in the tens of minutes and with a maximal global transaction rate of 5-10 per second. The Blockchain couldn't replace the banking system of single mid-sized town. It's not money. It's at best "digital gold", but more realistically it's just a ponzi scheme.
> With built in and inevitable deflation. Why is everyone thinking deflation is a bad thing? "Oh no, how horrible, my money isn't loosing value over time so I dont't have to buy things I don't need and can start to save money without loosing value"
Are You Trading or Gambling?
341–350 of 419 posts
Re: Are You Trading or Gambling?
#342Earlier quoted context omitted.
Each transactions has a fee value set by the sender, that goes to the miner. Miners select the top N transactions by fee, so miners will still have an incentive.
The fees are already exorbitant and make no sense if you wanted to use Bitcoin for everyday transactions. You still see merchants that have something like a 2$ minimum for credit card transactions, which charge a percentage fee usually. Looking at https://ycharts.com/indicators/bitcoin_average_transaction_f... the average Bitcoin fee seems to be somewhere around $22 right now. Just think of the dialog occurring once…
Without the presence of transaction fees though, things would fall apart once the block reward ran out, as asked in the original question.
Re: Are You Trading or Gambling?
#343Re: Are You Trading or Gambling?
#344Earlier quoted context omitted.
Also, I can buy a pizza for a coworker in a different country without worrying about exchange rates or anything else. FYI, everything you said can be done with cold hard cash.
You can buy your coworker a pizza with your credit card today. At most the fee would be 3%. From start to end the whole process would take no more than 5 mins. Plus, pretty much every decent pizzeria on the planet already accepts it as payment. The BTC transfer fee is something like $20 now, more than the cost of a pizza, and the transaction might take like an hour to clear? Maybe it's fine if you don't mind overpayi…
Segwit transfer is currently at $0.003, and a transaction with enough fee processes instantly. It takes 6 confirmations for a guarantee (but that will settle over the next hour). Pizza deliveries get paid in cash through many extensions that provide BTC2CASH purchase.
I can bet you buying a pizza in Spain with Spanish currency using a US card will charge you a foreign exchange fee.
Re: Are You Trading or Gambling?
#345Around 20 years ago, I had the opportunity to listen to a member of Nasdaq top management talk about the stock market. It's all a _tiny_ bit blurry, being a long time ago, but I remember how he talked about three different perspectives for investing in stock: First, the "company perspective". An investor would buy stock in a company they believed in. Maybe they had good products, or good management, or something else…
I'd say this precisely mirrors my journey through day trading. You start out with the naive mindset, thinking you can make money by finding strong undervalued companies and investing in them with stocks/LEAPS. Then when you've lost enough money trying that, you move on to technical analysis, thinking you can time the momentum and price action of "predictable" securities. Still thinking it's the "market" you're trying…
I'm relatively new to the stock market and still learning, can you confirm I understand?
You buy (say) n * 100 of the underlying, then you just sell OTM options. There's no link between the the underlying and the option, it's just collateral for the options in case the purchaser decides to exercise?
Your upside is that you make the premium + the strike price. You lose out if the share goes up past the strike + premium, but you win if it goes down, or not up enough?
So for example with ABNB, last trade 203.25. You buy 100, sell one option bundle for Mar'19 '21 202.5 strike for $15.60 per share.
If the share price goes above $218.85, you lose out on the difference, but you still get to keep the premium + strike, so you didn't really "lose" anything, you just didn't make as much.
If the share never goes above $218.85, you keep the shares, and are up by the premium price (in simple terms).
Is that the gist? Are there any other mechanics of this I've missed out? It seems Interactive Brokers will let me sell a call option without owning the underlying (edit: it seems there's a separate "write option" tool), so I guess if the option owner decides to exercise your broker somehow either just take the shares out of your account or makes you buy some?
How far out do you sell OTM options for?
Re: Are You Trading or Gambling?
#346Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, 11 years after its debut and nearly a trillion in valuation, still ridiculously ignorant statements like "delivers no value". It delivers no value you care about. Many people care about money that can't be inflated, can't be stopped from being traded, and can't be controlled across international borders. Those are hugely valuable to some people, whether you find it valuable or not.
> money With built in and inevitable deflation. Bitcoin could never replace a national currency. With transaction times in the tens of minutes and with a maximal global transaction rate of 5-10 per second. The Blockchain couldn't replace the banking system of single mid-sized town. It's not money. It's at best "digital gold", but more realistically it's just a ponzi scheme.
The fixed emission schedule of BTC means that there is no issuer that can capture increased demand in the good, but the holders of BTC get that benefit. So the only thing you need to bet on is if there will be more aggregate demand for the 21 million btc in the future than there is today.
With fiat currencies, when there is a crisis like COVID and the demand for money skyrockets, the fiat issuer can print out the money and do whatever it wants with that surplus demand.
If BTC makes it so the aggregate demand in currencies is split partially from fiat into BTC itself, then it will be a great transfer of wealth from governments into BTC owners.
There's your value.
Re: Are You Trading or Gambling?
#347Earlier quoted context omitted.
It isn't so much that P/E is rubbish but that its utility as a proxy metric assumes approximately flat revenue growth. This assumption is no longer true for a significant percentage of the largest companies, many of which are demonstrating large non-zero revenue growth rates, both positive and negative. If you are looking at companies with high revenue growth, there are other metrics used to determine if they are "ch…
But I think the opposite case still kind of holds, that with P/E you can at least see if a company is most likely not overvalued. And that was the issue in question ("everything is just gambling").
There are still measures that correlate well with low risk and strong returns for some subset of companies, but identifying a subset and building valuation models for them is non-trivial (e.g. I typically use risk models for revenue growth in comparative valuation which don't even apply to most of the market). If it was as simple as looking at a trivial ratio of public numbers, everyone would already be doing it.
I've been investing a long time and the markets have changed a lot over the decades. At this point, I think most of the investing advice from several decades ago is obsolete because it is based on assumptions that aren't actually true today. Investment advice and heuristics have a shelf-life. Most people aren't going to build a portfolio strategy from first principles, it is a lot of work, hence the popularity of index funds.
Re: Are You Trading or Gambling?
#348Earlier quoted context omitted.
> money With built in and inevitable deflation. Bitcoin could never replace a national currency. With transaction times in the tens of minutes and with a maximal global transaction rate of 5-10 per second. The Blockchain couldn't replace the banking system of single mid-sized town. It's not money. It's at best "digital gold", but more realistically it's just a ponzi scheme.
> With built in and inevitable deflation. Why is everyone thinking deflation is a bad thing? "Oh no, how horrible, my money isn't loosing value over time so I dont't have to buy things I don't need and can start to save money without loosing value"
[0] https://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/08/02/why-is-deflatio...
Re: Are You Trading or Gambling?
#349Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'd say this precisely mirrors my journey through day trading. You start out with the naive mindset, thinking you can make money by finding strong undervalued companies and investing in them with stocks/LEAPS. Then when you've lost enough money trying that, you move on to technical analysis, thinking you can time the momentum and price action of "predictable" securities. Still thinking it's the "market" you're trying…
> You buy lots of the underlying stock of something that's trending and start selling OTM "lottery ticket" contracts to the hapless fools (of which you used to be), and you finally start winning. I'm relatively new to the stock market and still learning, can you confirm I understand? You buy (say) n * 100 of the underlying, then you just sell OTM options. There's no link between the the underlying and the option, it'…
You still "lose" in the short term if the underlying goes down more than your premium covers. That's the risk you take on writing calls; the underlying can technically go to zero. But so long as it's a decent company with real earnings or growth potential, over time stocks always go back up.
>"If the share price goes above $218.85, you lose out on the difference, but you still get to keep the premium + strike, so you didn't really "lose" anything, you just didn't make as much."
Exactly. Although you technically still "lost", even if you didn't lose money, because you took on the risk of holding the underlying for longer than you collected in premiums (theta value of the option). But this, along with "cash secured puts"[0] is the basis of the "wheel" strategy. It goes like this:
Pick a strong stock you're generally bullish on long term and would be fine with owning -> Sell cash secured puts -> When the underlying drops to the point of your CSP hitting the money, get assigned at a price you wanted to buy it at anyways, keep the premium, and now you own the underlying -> Sell covered calls on the underlying until it rises to the point of being exercised -> Get exercised, keep the profit + premium -> Start over from step one.
>"It seems Interactive Brokers will let me sell a call option without owning the underlying (edit: it seems there's a separate "write option" tool), so I guess if the option owner decides to exercise your broker somehow either just take the shares out of your account or makes you buy some?"
That's a "naked call"; the black tar heroin of options. You can do it, but it's incredibly risky. Stocks can technically go up infinitely, meaning you're taking on infinite risk for a finite return. The GME debacle is a great example of how dangerous that can be for an individual. One huge overnight price movement can completely bankrupt you.
>"How far out do you sell OTM options for?"
It really depends on the underlying. That's why it's so important to follow a stock, and get to know how it trades over a few months before playing options on it. A general rule of thumb is ~%20 OTM on monthlies puts you in the sweet spot of premium/risk though.
[0] https://www.optionsplaybook.com/option-strategies/cash-secur...
Re: Are You Trading or Gambling?
#350This is only scratching the surface of the question. For interest, there's a very common negative expected value bet that almost everyone is required to make: insurance. We don't consider that gambling, in fact we often tell our parents to buy some when they fly on holiday. Why? The answer touches on the lottery. We care about not just the average case, we care about what might happen. Regarding Kelly criterion, ther…