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Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

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Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#271

Post by multiplegeorges »

jonfw wrote: post #157
dleslie wrote: post #99

I wish journalists wouldn't refer to Apple's app store cut as "tax" ; it's a service fee. That is the price Apple charges for providing payment-related services on its platform. It is not a tax.

Is my income tax a price the government charges for providing roads, schools, and protection? Just because there are services rendered doesn't mean it's not a tax. There is no opt out, and price is a function of earnings rather than value added.

There is an opt out. You might not like the opt out, but it remains a choice. You don't have to use Apple's platform or services.

Taxes imposed by a government are compulsory.

Words still have meaning and using tax to refer to Apple's fees is completely incorrect.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#272

Post by Spivak »

paulgb wrote: post #222
drewvolpe wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"You're Apple's customer and Facebook's product" is often repeated but completely true in this case. It's all about incentives. Apple makes money by selling more products which means they innovate by making Watches, Earpods, M1, etc. Facebook makes money by selling your attention and data, which meants they innovate by extracting data from every experience they can (Oculus, Whatsapp, ...), using more complex technolo…

Also, you literally are Apple’s product to their iOS developer ecosystem, in the sense that developers fork over 30% of their revenue to Apple for access to you.

This is absolutely true. Both companies play the game of selling customer acquisition. But we seem to be generally more okay with middlemen squeezing a two sided market. Sometimes. If it’s DoorDash or Amazon then public opinion seems to go the other way.

But regardless it’s not Facebook’s value prop to business that people have an issue with but ya know, how they actually deliver it.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#273

Post by specialp »

coldpie wrote: post #31
yawaworht1978 wrote: post #11

Apple should be applauded for this. Their revenue does not depend on software to clandestinely steal and sell users data. One day, we will look back at history and see facebook similar as to how people view myspace now (junkyard of software). Good on Apple not selling devices with a facebook backdoor in them. I know apple probably has deals with malicious governments regarding data access, but at least they are stand…

Between this privacy fight and the form factor of the iPhone Mini, there's a 90% chance my next phone will be an iPhone after more than a decade on Android. I'm done with this ad-sponsored trash ecosystem.

I'm moving to Apple after being a long time iPhone hater. With how insidious Google is getting with Android they should be paying me to use my flagship phone, not me paying roughly the same amount of an iPhone. I do everything I can to not feed into the (free*) services with the cost being sucking down more data about me than I know about myself.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#274

Post by ogre_codes »

bob33212 wrote: post #68
pyrophane wrote: post #20

> Apple says in the coming weeks, it will update its iOS software for iPhones to require apps to get explicit consent to track what people are doing on their phones for the purposes of sharing it with third-parties. That's all they are doing. They aren't preventing companies from tracking users in this way. They are just requiring them to get permission. Says a lot about Facebook's business model that this is a cause…

What is to stop Facebook from making a picture show up all fuzzy and then tell the user that they should opt-in to tracking to get the highest resolution pictures.

Facebook isn't concerned with what happens within the Facebook App itself. Everything there is already tracked and filtered. What they are most concerned about is that a huge pile of outside apps which are feeding them data by including their APIs will opt out of including Facebook's APIs because the indie apps don't want to display this warning.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#275

Post by ddtaylor »

thenewwazoo wrote: post #244

Fuckin' let 'em. I'll pick Apple over Facebook eight days a week, and if Facebook takes their ball and goes home, well, even better since it'll finally get me to completely pull the plug on their platform.

What's stopping you from quitting Facebook right now and how does this change that?

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#276

Post by landryraccoon »

paulgb wrote: post #222
drewvolpe wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"You're Apple's customer and Facebook's product" is often repeated but completely true in this case. It's all about incentives. Apple makes money by selling more products which means they innovate by making Watches, Earpods, M1, etc. Facebook makes money by selling your attention and data, which meants they innovate by extracting data from every experience they can (Oculus, Whatsapp, ...), using more complex technolo…

Also, you literally are Apple’s product to their iOS developer ecosystem, in the sense that developers fork over 30% of their revenue to Apple for access to you.

On one hand, it's argued that Apple has an incentive to act against their customers because they want to sell apps on the app store.

On the other hand, it's argued that Apple doesn't care about their developers because they enforce draconian regulations on what iOS developers are allowed and not allowed to do, and don't hesitate even to shut down billion dollar apps (i.e., Fortnite).

I have mixed feelings about Apple's walled garden, both as a developer and a user, but when it comes to user privacy, I'm firmly in Apple's camp. I can't think of a single other large tech company that has a strong stand in favor of user privacy and acted on that. Basically, if Privacy is a killer feature for a consumer, then Apple is literally the only game in town.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#277

Post by Veen »

Clubber wrote: post #159
Spooky23 wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's really weird. I don't think the "threat" is the obvious one... Nobody trusts Facebook -- many, if not most, people honestly believe they listen to their conversations already. The real message is how emotional and immature the leadership is to a perceived slight. A message that said "Cigarettes will kill you" didn't stop smokers, and some label won't stop Facebook users or meaningfully impact Facebook. Hell, whe…

>A message that said "Cigarettes will kill you" didn't stop smokers Nicotine is as hard to quit as heroin. The fact that we still punished smokers through public shaming, exclusion and excessive fines just shows how unsympathetic our culture is to perceived "moral failings." https://www.heart.org/en/news/2018/10/17/why-its-so-hard-to-...

Yes, it is odd that many who deem shaming an effective strategy where smoking is concerned deem it ineffective and counter-productive for obesity, narcotic addition, and other undesirable behaviors.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#278

Post by multiplegeorges »

smilliken wrote: post #195
dleslie wrote: post #99

I wish journalists wouldn't refer to Apple's app store cut as "tax" ; it's a service fee. That is the price Apple charges for providing payment-related services on its platform. It is not a tax.

Apple also insists that you must use their payment services, you can't use a competitor's. the policies are designed so that they get a cut of all revenue in the ecosystem, that's effectively a tax.

> Apple also insists that you must use their payment services, you can't use a competitor's.

Yes, you can. Put your app on Android. Done.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#280

Post by Dma54rhs »

viktorcode wrote: post #143
yawaworht1978 wrote: post #11

Apple should be applauded for this. Their revenue does not depend on software to clandestinely steal and sell users data. One day, we will look back at history and see facebook similar as to how people view myspace now (junkyard of software). Good on Apple not selling devices with a facebook backdoor in them. I know apple probably has deals with malicious governments regarding data access, but at least they are stand…

> I know apple probably has deals with malicious governments regarding data access Would love to see some evidence of that. That's quite an accusation and it should be taken seriously.

It's common sense they wouldn't be able to do business in China without it?
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