The Art of Reading More Effectively and Efficiently • Hacker News Board

Re: The Art of Reading More Effectively and Efficiently

#51

Post by devnull255 » Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 3:34 PM UTC

benrbray wrote: post #19

I think this is missing an important fourth objective: reading to remember. I'm not sure how much others can relate, but I am hopeless at remembering most of what I read or watch. Even when I spend several days pondering the same book chapter / paper / recipe / etc, taking thorough notes, there is no guarantee I will remember it six months or even one month from now. I started to realize that I was collecting new dat…

I've found the importance of remembering a book you've read depends on why you're reading the book in the first place. If you're reading to entertain, remembering what you've read isn't nearly as important as the experience you get reading it. It's why I've reread so many of the science fiction and fantasy books I love. Reading a book again, especially long after the original reading of it, re-ignites the pleasure of the experience of the first reading.

The third and fourth levels of reading often require the reader to do exactly what you describe. I've actually started using paper index cards to do this, creating physically cataloged notes, which through the muscle memory of writing, help to embed the most important concepts and idea in my brain.

I personally read a lot of books that inform or advance important ideas casually first. Then I go back and re-read sections, taking notes more carefully to properly ingest the critical topics into memory.

Re: The Art of Reading More Effectively and Efficiently

#52

Post by dawg- » Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 3:36 PM UTC

criddell wrote: post #30

dawg- wrote: post #26

I have noticed an interesting trend in our discourse about reading lately - there seems to be more and more moralizing and virtue signaling. So much self-help and "motivation porn" focuses on reading books, as if it's a magical activity that will unlock the best version of oneself. It's part of the new aspirational message - imagine yourself rich, happy, driving a Lamborghini, living off dividends from your stonks, a…

> imagine yourself rich, happy, driving a Lamborghini, living off dividends from your stonks, and reading books I was immediately reminded of Lambo Tai. I still think it's a parody of something... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cv1RJTHf5fk

Yup, that's who I had in mind. He is a sort of patron saint of this cultural trend, I think

Re: The Art of Reading More Effectively and Efficiently

#53

Post by bikingtoTJs » Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 3:36 PM UTC

_cloudkate wrote: post #48

benrbray wrote: post #19

I think this is missing an important fourth objective: reading to remember. I'm not sure how much others can relate, but I am hopeless at remembering most of what I read or watch. Even when I spend several days pondering the same book chapter / paper / recipe / etc, taking thorough notes, there is no guarantee I will remember it six months or even one month from now. I started to realize that I was collecting new dat…

Completely agree with this comment and thank you for sharing your pointers for better quality/more effective reading. Side note.. while I think your comment was meant to be educational & helpful in nature, I just wanted to say, there's also something beautifully poetic about the statement "reading to remember". It gave me all the feels!

came here to say the same thing! That phrase stood out when I was scrolling through the comments. nice

Re: The Art of Reading More Effectively and Efficiently

#54

Post by dominotw » Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 3:36 PM UTC

dawg- wrote: post #26

I have noticed an interesting trend in our discourse about reading lately - there seems to be more and more moralizing and virtue signaling. So much self-help and "motivation porn" focuses on reading books, as if it's a magical activity that will unlock the best version of oneself. It's part of the new aspirational message - imagine yourself rich, happy, driving a Lamborghini, living off dividends from your stonks, a…

> I have noticed an interesting trend in our discourse about reading lately

>imagine yourself rich, happy, driving a Lamborghini, living off dividends from your stonks, and reading books.

This is bill gates, warren buffet. He says this is his secret, who am I to question someone who has actually done it.

https://www.gatesnotes.com/About-Bill-Gates/Summer-Books-202...

"Whether you’re looking for a distraction or just spending a lot more time at home, you can’t beat reading a book. "

Re: The Art of Reading More Effectively and Efficiently

#55

Post by Bakary » Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 3:40 PM UTC

I really don't see the point of all that productivity in every facet of life. It sounds like cargo-culting to me. Generally, people who do fascinating things don't need to analyze their own productivity since they are naturally drawn to their projects and work on them on their own and for their own sake. People who do things out of ambition don't need the boost either, by definition. And for people who just want to enjoy life, this sort of thinking is antithetical to what they see as worthwhile. Therefore this content can only appeal to those in a state of dissatisfaction and confusion as to what they want out of existence, but does not provide them with any sort of useful answer.

From a cursory glance at the channel, it's all very ironic: the guy shares tips about having become a doctor and done extremely well in medical school, but quit after two years because his channel about productivity was taking off. Don't get me wrong, I respect the hustle and the cashflow, but it highlights the circularity of the whole enterprise. The productivity is channeled to create content on productivity that is itself of no particular value except as entertainment for unproductive and anxious people. It's like those online courses on becoming rich that are themselves the source of the wealth. From an individual perspective, it's great that the author can make a lot more money with a lot less stress compared to medical work, but from a societal perspective it seems like we've created an ocean of perverse incentives.

Re: The Art of Reading More Effectively and Efficiently

#56

Post by dawg- » Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 3:49 PM UTC

dougmwne wrote: post #50

dawg- wrote: post #26

I have noticed an interesting trend in our discourse about reading lately - there seems to be more and more moralizing and virtue signaling. So much self-help and "motivation porn" focuses on reading books, as if it's a magical activity that will unlock the best version of oneself. It's part of the new aspirational message - imagine yourself rich, happy, driving a Lamborghini, living off dividends from your stonks, a…

I've been thinking about the halo around books on and off for years. I think whatever special value books used to represent in our society from before the internet is long gone. I remember the pre-internet times when the information world you had access to was small. You could consume silly low-information things on the tv or radio or you could read a book on the topic, which had a much higher information density and…

There is definitely a ton of value to be had from learning on the internet. Watching a 2 hour 92nd street Y debate on Youtube can be just as enlightening as reading a great book. But I still think books have a certain staying power due to their format.

The rigor of longform reading is still something special. I know I am prone to over-quoting from Thoreau, but as he said, "What is taken as argument in the auditorium is too often later found to be rhetoric in the study."

Re: The Art of Reading More Effectively and Efficiently

#57

Post by dawg- » Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 3:56 PM UTC

dominotw wrote: post #54

dawg- wrote: post #26

I have noticed an interesting trend in our discourse about reading lately - there seems to be more and more moralizing and virtue signaling. So much self-help and "motivation porn" focuses on reading books, as if it's a magical activity that will unlock the best version of oneself. It's part of the new aspirational message - imagine yourself rich, happy, driving a Lamborghini, living off dividends from your stonks, a…

> I have noticed an interesting trend in our discourse about reading lately >imagine yourself rich, happy, driving a Lamborghini, living off dividends from your stonks, and reading books. This is bill gates, warren buffet. He says this is his secret, who am I to question someone who has actually done it. https://www.gatesnotes.com/About-Bill-Gates/Summer-Books-202... "Whether you’re looking for a distraction or just…

I don't see Bill Gates attributing reading to his success at all. This is just a blog post saying he likes to read when he's bored around the house?

Re: The Art of Reading More Effectively and Efficiently

#58

Post by matthewfcarlson » Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 3:59 PM UTC

j7ake wrote: post #37

dawg- wrote: post #26

I have noticed an interesting trend in our discourse about reading lately - there seems to be more and more moralizing and virtue signaling. So much self-help and "motivation porn" focuses on reading books, as if it's a magical activity that will unlock the best version of oneself. It's part of the new aspirational message - imagine yourself rich, happy, driving a Lamborghini, living off dividends from your stonks, a…

The worst is some arbitrary goal of reading X books per year. That clearly optimises for short, easy to read books (eg New York Times Best Sellers) and avoids more technical and difficult books (eg Art of Computer Programming)

I love to read and always have since I was a kid. Over the years I’d just fallen out of the habit, similar to how I don’t watch movies much anymore. I set a goal to read a large number of books since I’d slowly collected a long list and just went in order. If I wasn’t enjoying a book as much as I thought I would, back to the library it went. I found it quite helpful to have a goal in mind.

I will agree with you that the temptation was there just to read fluff. I think having the list effectively mitigated that. The only downside is that many books reference other books so the list would just expand exponentially.

Am I magically able to access the secrets of universe just because I read a lot? No. But when people ask me “read any good books lately” I can talk about the new Brandon Sanderson book, neuroscience of aging, or the art of non violent communication and the interesting parallels between all three of them.

Reading does make you more interesting but so does watching Sundance film festival movies or listening to obscure podcasts. Anything off the beaten path is interesting by definition.

Re: The Art of Reading More Effectively and Efficiently

#59

Post by jk7tarYZAQNpTQa » Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 4:01 PM UTC

tharkun__ wrote: post #42

tines wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But ultimately you could learn just as much about yourself and the world by doing pottery, woodworking, kayaking, knitting or whatever else you like to do with your spare time. I agree with the rest of your post, but this sentence is a hard disagree. Books let you live a version of the lives of other more intelligent people from almost any point in history. How can pottery and kayaking do that?

Kayaking at least (not sure how much concentration pottery needs) would give you a _lot_ of time to just stare at the beauty of nature and think. Now this may or may not result in anything, but if you are reasonably intelligent and trying to improve yourself but you are lacking the 'downtime' to just let your mind wander then kayaking might do the trick for you. Best combined with a good book for when you're in camp,…

I dearly love both sports and reading, but they are very different activities that give you happiness in very different ways. Kayaking won't teach you quantum mechanics or ancient Greek history. So from a certain knowledge-adquisition point of view, pottery and kayaking are way less efficient, if not a waste of time. Just like reading is a waste of time from the physical happiness POV.

As with most things in life, a good balance is needed.

Re: The Art of Reading More Effectively and Efficiently

#60

Post by matthewfcarlson » Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 4:06 PM UTC

dawg- wrote: post #44

tines wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But ultimately you could learn just as much about yourself and the world by doing pottery, woodworking, kayaking, knitting or whatever else you like to do with your spare time. I agree with the rest of your post, but this sentence is a hard disagree. Books let you live a version of the lives of other more intelligent people from almost any point in history. How can pottery and kayaking do that?

> Books let you live a version of the lives of other more intelligent people from almost any point in history. How can pottery and kayaking do that? I do agree with your statement about books, because I personally love reading. Henry David Thoreau wrote a chapter of Walden called "Reading", and put it way better than I ever could: > "To read well, that is, to read true books in a true spirit, is a noble exercise, and…

I agree with you on most of these points and would argue the defining traits you’re putting forth is curiosity and some grit. You’re curious about pottery and will learn about it but with enough grit and obsession that you’ll actually do it and once you’ve done it once you want to know more. Most people I know (including myself) have a tough time staying curious once you get that initial taste. You see the cool textile mill and in the moment wish you knew more but by the time you get home your mind is elsewhere.