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Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

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Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#341

Post by stiray »

throwaway3699 wrote: post #294
stiray wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Analytics isn't just about conversion. Analytics is about the entire product experience. ... which you can entirely do by analyzing web server logs. You dont need google for this, pushing your users (with violation of GDPR consent) into google monstrosity. Dont do that, I block every freaking google domain from cdns, fonts to analytics. But I don't block 1st party analytics. I have no reason to. I have visited your…

FWIW, there are many well known techniques for shipping data to GA regardless if you block it or not. Many integrate server-side for this reason (as you say - server logs are very rich), and client side is used supplementally. Some are using sneaky techniques to move requests through 1P domains. Adblockers make zero difference.

> Some are using sneaky techniques to move requests through 1P domains

Just for an info, I have written a mitming proxy that takes care of those (cname cloaking) and a lot of other things, including fingerprinting, supercookies etc., with support for various blocklist (domain to adblock), js injection where the injected scripts are handled in same manner as blocklist (you can stockpile them and make rules), changing validity of cookies (to session cookies for instance), saves your data trough highly effective caching and even helps spying cdns save some bandwidth as they are mostly no longer visited. And yes, works as transparent proxy too (for router enforced usage). Imagine fully armored firefox for whole network, regardless of browser, freebsd,linux,windows,arm8. Working on cross platform gui, release soon.

So I might know a thing or two. ;)

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#343

Post by dazc »

jamesdhutton wrote: post #169
dazc wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If internet advertising didn't exist then there would be only half a dozen recipes for scrambled eggs to be found, not the thousands there are now.

... and probably not much else. I love the way I can type in whatever combination of ingredients I happen to have in my pantry, and get a bunch of free recipes with those ingredients. I doubt that would have happened without internet advertising.

Fair point

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#344

Post by gerash »

nerdjon wrote: post #15
purpmint008 wrote: post #7

Sure. But, let's also stop feeding the Apple App Store beast. 15-30% cut for little-to-no value added. Complete monopolization. Can't side-load apps without paying an yearly-fee.

Not sure what the relevance too this article is. There is a major difference between someone actively choosing to use an iPhone vs a web developer choosing for you to send your data too Google because they included some script. (Also I would argue the number of security issues that there have been in apps on Android sure helps warrant that cut)

Let's just swap entities in your sentence, shall we:

"There's a major difference between someone actively choosing to go to a website vs a phone manufacturer choosing for you what you can and cannot run on your device."

QED.

Also exploits for latest Android versions are more expensive than latest iOS versions. Let's not conflate topics however

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#345

Post by JGM_io »

slavak wrote: post #338
mqrs wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes but it’s not necessarily Google analytics.

There's plenty of alternatives to Google Analytics, including open-source software you can self-host so it doesn't share your users' private data with a third party. You don't need to roll your own just to avoid GA.

For example?

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#346

Post by blacklight »

Firefox+NoScript+PiHole user here. Once the pages on your browser start rendering at twice the speed they normally render on other people's devices because you block all the analytics and ads crap, you never look back.

And even though I don't use any analytics on my websites (heck, some of them don't even run a line of JS), I still get plenty of valuable (and privacy-aware) insights about user experience.

Web server logs are a source of user activity that has been almost forgotten. You can infer a lot of information (from what page a user came, to which page they navigated next etc.) from the logs alone. All you have is the IP address of a browser, which might as well be spoofed/proxied, but do you really need anything else than an ephemeral and loose user identifier if your goal is just to make sure that users spend time on your website? Why would we delegate such a simple task to a company that pollutes and slows down our web pages with their bloated analytics and isn't transparent with us about what they do with that data?

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#347

Post by arcturus17 »

dealforager wrote: post #278
aembleton wrote: post #263

This ends with the author promoting his new 'bootstrapped app': https://keepthescore.co/ That website uses Google Analytics!

Well, it looks like they succeeded in their goal which was to funnel traffic to their site. It's now a top post on HN, with a top comment directly linking to their site, and I'm sure it will be shared in other places. This is partly why I'm not sure about blocking ads. I'd rather have ads be ads, and not have to read everything like it's a research paper to know if it's secretly an ad. Aside from personal blogs and f…

I’m pretty sure that if all the ads in the world were unblocked you’d still see inordinate amounts of SEO bullshit everywhere.

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#348

Post by hizxy »

edmundsauto wrote: post #319
pcstl wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're essentially arguing for qualitative data instead of quantitative, but both together is usually where the money is. I agree that qualitative analytics are underestimatd because they're hard to do, but I also think that having quantitative analytics together with qualitative allows you to contextualize your numbers in ways that lead to insights you wouldn't have otherwise. Also, after you've already reached prod…

Qualitative data has another challenge - representativeness. It's very easy to do 10 user interviews and feel comfortable that you understand the market. Our brains lie to us all the time. Quantitative data lets you drill down into different dimensions. Because it is much easier to collect at scale (it's the sum of your users' interaction w/ your product, after all!), it's much easier to make representative decisions…

No it isn’t because the data will never tell you “why” people are doing something or not doing something. You can guess but you’ll never know why until you a) talk to users and b) watch them use your product. Qualitative research isn’t about statistical significance, it’s about deep insights. 10 user interviews will undercover 100 insights.

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#349

Post by hizxy »

musicale wrote: post #216
boplicity wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Huh? Analytics is how you focus on your product. For the first decade of my career, I really believed this, and spent a lot of time doing split tests, and studying analytics, and trying to "make things better" by understanding the numbers as they were given to me. This was a mistake. I've since learned that these numbers will rarely help me make meaningful improvements to my product, and my business. Sure, they can…

Apple famously "ignores" its users, partly because users usually can't see far beyond what is in front of them, often because they don't know about impending advances in technology or clever new designs. They'll ask for faster, cheaper versions of what they already have (faster horses, cheaper buggy whips as they say) rather than the next big thing. Faster/cheaper weren't the primary draws of the Mac, iPod, iPhone, i…

This myth just will not die. Apple doesn’t listen to users’ opinions but they sure as hell observe user behavior.

Re: Google Analytics: Stop feeding the beast

#350

Post by _a9 »

JGM_io wrote: post #345
slavak wrote: post #338

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's plenty of alternatives to Google Analytics, including open-source software you can self-host so it doesn't share your users' private data with a third party. You don't need to roll your own just to avoid GA.

For example?

Matomo
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