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The Framework Laptop

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Re: The Framework Laptop

#701

Post by QuinnWilton »

Tijdreiziger wrote: post #698
nrp wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Our Embedded Controller firmware is based on chromium ec, and we're using a mature off the shelf BIOS solution shipping in other notebooks today. We chose our key components with driver stability across both Windows and Linux in mind. We know this is something we have to get right to deliver a credible competitor to all the great notebooks already in the market, so it is something we focused on from the start.

> Our Embedded Controller firmware is based on chromium ec Sorry, I'm having trouble parsing this statement. Your 'embedded controller' (whatever that may be) firmware is based on a web browser?

Chromium EC. It's the part of Chromebooks that handles things like keypresses: https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromiumos/platform/ec/+/m...

Re: The Framework Laptop

#702

Post by eightails »

Tijdreiziger wrote: post #698
nrp wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Our Embedded Controller firmware is based on chromium ec, and we're using a mature off the shelf BIOS solution shipping in other notebooks today. We chose our key components with driver stability across both Windows and Linux in mind. We know this is something we have to get right to deliver a credible competitor to all the great notebooks already in the market, so it is something we focused on from the start.

> Our Embedded Controller firmware is based on chromium ec Sorry, I'm having trouble parsing this statement. Your 'embedded controller' (whatever that may be) firmware is based on a web browser?

I think they are referring to part of the Chromium OS project, which seems to be open source firmware for basic device functions including "power sequencing, keyboard control, thermal control, battery charging, and verified boot" [0]

[0] https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromiumos/platform/ec/+/m...

Re: The Framework Laptop

#703

Post by dang »

Threads are paginated for performance reasons (yes we're working on it), so to see the rest of the comments you need to click More at the bottom of the page, or like this:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26263508&p=2

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26263508&p=3

Apologies for the annoying repetition. It will eventually go away.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#704

Post by Tijdreiziger »

eightails wrote: post #702
Tijdreiziger wrote: post #698

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Our Embedded Controller firmware is based on chromium ec Sorry, I'm having trouble parsing this statement. Your 'embedded controller' (whatever that may be) firmware is based on a web browser?

I think they are referring to part of the Chromium OS project, which seems to be open source firmware for basic device functions including "power sequencing, keyboard control, thermal control, battery charging, and verified boot" [0] [0] https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromiumos/platform/ec/+/m...

Ah, I didn't know Chrome OS had an OSS counterpart. Thanks!

Re: The Framework Laptop

#705

Post by k_sze »

nrp wrote: post #183
samizdis wrote: post #103

Ars Technica has a sceptical but optimistic/hopeful take on it: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/02/framework-startup-de... Edit to add quote from Ars article: Framework is promising an awful lot in its very first product—"thin as an XPS 13, repairable as a custom-built gaming PC" is a pretty tall order to live up to. We very much want to believe, but it's going to take a full Ars Technica teardown before we're c…

"thin as an XPS 13, repairable as a custom-built gaming PC" was not actually a direct quote from us, but it's nice that the folks at Ars think of our design that way!

I can’t stand small screens, so here’s me hoping you’ll make a 15” or 16” model with 4K screen soon after this one.

Also looking forward to AMD or ARM instead of Intel.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#706

Post by BugsJustFindMe »

boogies wrote: post #697
BugsJustFindMe wrote: post #686

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now I can't tell if this thread is meant to be satire. > f20 selects this discussion (the 20th link) but I used f4 to select threads (the 4th link) So first you have to visually recognize every link in between the beginning and what you want to choose and then you have to count them all? I hope you don't miscount! > j,D, and scroll down by a line, half-screen/page and full-screen/page respectively How many lines, hal…

I believe every single statement in your comment is factually false. The only one I don’t feel objectively certain of is this: > Just curious. But I sincerely doubt it’s true based on the tone of your comment. I’m willing to walk through each sentence with you, but as I have already sunk significant time into trying to help you I politely request that you first prove my doubt unfounded by investing five minutes in gr…

> The browser automatically highlights them

What do you do when the browser doesn't highlight something interactive?

What do you do for, as one person on the web calls it, "fancy javascript shit"? What if you want to draw an iceberg to see how it would float?

Re: The Framework Laptop

#707

Post by samstave »

durst wrote: post #418
samstave wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just an anecdote on the value of modular and repairable hardware: Compaq vs Sun: I was the IT Director for Decide.com in ~1998-ish and we had a bunch of compaq servers and a bunch of SUN servers... At the time - SUN was *giving* servers to startups to adopt their HW. I had to build out a ton of systems in various DCs and the SUN machines were not rack-mountable, but were like $50,000 a unit... and they had this *secu…

Very cool! Did others in the company appreciate the benefits of repairable hardware? Also, $50,000 sounds like a lot of money. Was that price considered giving it away?

>>*Also, $50,000 sounds like a lot of money. *

OMG do you want to hear war stories about SGI?

Turning SGI machines into keg-or-atores at Lucasfilm when consolodatiting to the presidio when all these Octanes and others were at ILM in Marin?

Yeah - many a machine was turned into a bar...

Heck the team building exercises at FB were to "build a bar for your team..."

Re: The Framework Laptop

#708

Post by knz_ »

As cool as this is, it's a DOA product with no real market outside super savvy consumers. Uninformed consumers already buy the cheapest laptops they can find on Amazon or in the store.

If repairability is super important to someone, what incentive is there to buy this over a used thinkpad? You can get skylake thinkpads for less than $200 on ebay - replacement batteries and displays cost less than $100.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#709

Post by Terretta »

sib wrote: post #431
tomtheelder wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the SD card example encapsulates the issue perfectly. I'm pretty sure that in 2021 that is an _extreme_ niche use case. I feel like only extremely serious photographers and perhaps a particular slice of musicians use them. It makes absolutely no sense for them to have that built into the laptop. 99% of people who own Macbooks or whatever don't own an SD card dongle because they don't need it. However, and ext…

And most "extremely serious photographers" today are probably using cameras for which SD cards are not the storage format (or at least the preferred format.)

Exactly. And since we might carry more than one model of camera with dissimilar memory cards, the Mac could need 3 or 4 slots. That’s why the good pro photo USB-C adapters have 3 or 4 slots.

Further, those readers seem to be made /just/ fast enough to read ahead of the current speeds, so when new speeds come out, you need a faster reader. That works fine if you have a USB 3.1 or USB 3.2 adapter, but not so great if the reader is built into a laptop with an otherwise much longer life.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#710

Post by soheil »

If I have to install Ubuntu Desktop or god forbid Windows to use your laptop you already lost me. Why doesn’t someone try to tackle the operating system problem first? I literally don’t care about the physical laptop as much as the software running on it. Also everyone always says hardware is hard so why not focus on a software solution for existing laptops? If there was an operating system half as good as Apple’s I’d never buy a MacBook again.
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