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Ethereum Isn't Fun Anymore

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Re: Ethereum Isn't Fun Anymore

#531

Post by chowells »

rudderz wrote: post #510
chowells wrote: post #488

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope. That's the sort of argument that makes your position weaker. You see, USD has a government that asserts it is legal tender for all debts within its borders and military power to back up those assertions. These are the sort of real-world constraints that you can't just ignore. Attempting to do so makes me less charitable towards other assertions you might make. You come across as an idealist talking about their…

> These are the sort of real-world constraints that you can't just ignore. These constraints were drafted by a handful of rich white bankers in a secret meeting. I have no problem ignoring their constraints. It seems you do. Can you imagine all the hot-takes HN would generate if email were invented today? "You can't just encroach on the sovereignty of USPS like that" "Electronic Mail doesn't do anything the pony-expr…

While it's tempting to conflate the beneficiaries of our problems with those who created them, reality is not that simple. Blaming things on an all-powerful cabal of bankers is nearing QAnon levels of seeking a small number of people to blame for systemic issues. That sort of reductionism isn't useful. Action taken based on it is going to never touch any real problem. At most it'll change who benefits from them.

I think we can do better.

(As for your email counterfactual... Why? Do you find it an effective rhetorical tactic to imagine what people might do instead of looking at what people have done?)

Re: Ethereum Isn't Fun Anymore

#532

Post by estaseuropano »

dorkwood wrote: post #474
lazzlazzlazz wrote: post #375

The Hacker News community has long been anti-crypto, and as someone deeply involved in the space, these long threads of complaints and diatribes are difficult to handle. Everyone is missing so much context. Ethereum gas prices are astronomical because there's unprecedented demand to use the network: NFT art and collectibles are exploding (NBA TopShot, Foundation, SuperRare, Rarible, OpenSea, etc.) at the same time De…

> The naysayers who think this is all for a quick buck are missing the pattern and listening too much to the (admittedly, insanely loud and annoying) shills. I'm part of a community that's currently being overtaken by the crypto art craze, and I'm still convinced it's "all for a quick buck". The crypto art economy seems to be driven by "collectors" who will drop thousands of dollars on anyone who can get them more ex…

Probably still just a big money laundering/tax evasion operation, like much of the real art world...

Re: Ethereum Isn't Fun Anymore

#533

Post by gamblor956 »

lynx234 wrote: post #527
gamblor956 wrote: post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think law would prevent a fully collateralized loan on the basis of borrower/lender risks. It doesn't. AML seems a non issue too, as the loan only moves the question. No, anti-money-laundering laws are at the heart of why the financial system can't do this. KYC laws apply at the customer level, so you only need to handle KYC once per customer. AML laws apply at the transaction level, so you need to apply them…

> Cryptocurrency solves absolutely none of the existing legal reasons that banks can't issue large loans in minutes or seconds to existing (or new, well collateralized) clients. Yes, this is definitely correct in that crypto does nothing to solve the legal requirements of the banks and does not help the banks. But it's worth mentioning that this sort of fully collateralized and anonymous borrowing does not (and would…

Banks don't need to issue fully collateralized loans. That is not a thing people need to do in the real world, because banks will gladly issue partially collateralized loans.

As for anonymous loans, those exist solely to service criminal customers, so that is not an advantage of cryptocurrency.

Re: Ethereum Isn't Fun Anymore

#534

Post by dTal »

lazzlazzlazz wrote: post #375

The Hacker News community has long been anti-crypto, and as someone deeply involved in the space, these long threads of complaints and diatribes are difficult to handle. Everyone is missing so much context. Ethereum gas prices are astronomical because there's unprecedented demand to use the network: NFT art and collectibles are exploding (NBA TopShot, Foundation, SuperRare, Rarible, OpenSea, etc.) at the same time De…

>The Hacker News community has long been anti-crypto

Are we really allowing blockchains to annex the word "crypto"? "Crypto" is "cryptography". HN is not "anti-crypto", it is staunchly pro-encryption.

Re: Ethereum Isn't Fun Anymore

#535

Post by throwaway829 »

lasc4r wrote: post #446
rawtxapp wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's over-collaterized, so you put more crypto than the loan value. You might say "why the hell would I do that?", in order of importance: 1) you hold on to your asset's appreciation, 2) access the liquidity, 3) avoid capital gains tax.

So the killer use case is a scheme to avoid capital gains taxes? Sounds about right.

You realize elites are already doing this with USD. It's not unique to crypto.

Re: Ethereum Isn't Fun Anymore

#536

Post by olah_1 »

khongbietgi wrote: post #66

How about https://www.algorand.com/ The team is promising and also their sdk is quite good.

I know that they use the same Clarity[1] smart contract language as Stacks. I like that it's not turing complete.

The more I've read about Stacks, the more I like it. But I haven't done a deep dive into Algorand. Do you know offhand how they differ / what they're going for?

[1]: https://clarity-lang.org/

Re: Ethereum Isn't Fun Anymore

#537

Post by csa »

lazzlazzlazz wrote: post #489
csa wrote: post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 2. Yes. This is sadly a non-answer to the question posed. I am asked this question all the time by people I know, and the best I can come up with is illegal activities, super niche tech applications (e.g., DNS name reg), and libertarian fantasies. You have an audience here at HN who is more than willing to advocate for cryptocurrencies if they/we can be shown a compelling use case. “Yes” is not an obvious compellin…

I have this discussion at least once a week. What would you build if you could deploy an uninterruptible, transparently verifiable, fully autonomous software application? I promise you that we can discuss many examples (any kind of marketplace or platform but with community governance and no rents, decentralized exchanges, global-by-default payments, highly interoperable and efficient financial infrastructure), but w…

I will be sure to relay this answer to my non-tech friends who ask about cryptocurrencies.

I’m sure this answer will send them running to buy.

/s

All joking aside, for a conversation you say you have weekly, this is a really lame answer due to the abstractness of it.

My guess is the reason you don’t give concrete answers is because either tech already exists for that use case or non-crypto tech could be easily developed if it doesn’t already exist.

Please, please, prove me wrong. I want to be a crypto fan, but vague answers like the ones you provided above are the reason a lot of people think crypto is smoke and mirrors and/or snake oil salesmen.

Re: Ethereum Isn't Fun Anymore

#538

Post by TomSwirly »

lazzlazzlazz wrote: post #375

The Hacker News community has long been anti-crypto, and as someone deeply involved in the space, these long threads of complaints and diatribes are difficult to handle. Everyone is missing so much context. Ethereum gas prices are astronomical because there's unprecedented demand to use the network: NFT art and collectibles are exploding (NBA TopShot, Foundation, SuperRare, Rarible, OpenSea, etc.) at the same time De…

It's been ten years. The killer app for crypto is just one thing - crime. Money laundering, tax evasion, purchasing contraband.

And yes, people have made a lot of money on pure speculation too. That's not an application.

Until we see some actual real-world uses for crypto - full-time, serious uses, not someone buying a pizza as a demo - that aren't crime, we have every logical reason to be desperately skeptical of this overhyped technology.

Re: Ethereum Isn't Fun Anymore

#539

Post by TomSwirly »

rudderz wrote: post #510
chowells wrote: post #488

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope. That's the sort of argument that makes your position weaker. You see, USD has a government that asserts it is legal tender for all debts within its borders and military power to back up those assertions. These are the sort of real-world constraints that you can't just ignore. Attempting to do so makes me less charitable towards other assertions you might make. You come across as an idealist talking about their…

> These are the sort of real-world constraints that you can't just ignore. These constraints were drafted by a handful of rich white bankers in a secret meeting. I have no problem ignoring their constraints. It seems you do. Can you imagine all the hot-takes HN would generate if email were invented today? "You can't just encroach on the sovereignty of USPS like that" "Electronic Mail doesn't do anything the pony-expr…

I remember when email became a thing.

No one said those things. Why would they?

Re: Ethereum Isn't Fun Anymore

#540

Post by phamilton »

rawtxapp wrote: post #416
lisperforlife wrote: post #399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. It took me a long time to understand this. I was so focused on the volatility that I failed to look at the larger trend. It clicked for me only a couple of months back.

Same here, it took me a while to understand why anyone would get an over-collaterized loan until it just clicked, then I was like this is the future, it doesn't make any sense to sell the most valuable and appreciating asset ever, but you can still use the money from it.

> sell the most valuable and appreciating asset ever

What happens when it stops appreciating? Or is the premise that bitcoin will alway outpace interest rates?

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