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Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

1b677b8f8bb20100.github.io

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Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#161

Post by fay59 »

fay59 wrote: post #159
ethbr0 wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. And we could do the same back to you. Presumably society would eventually get over itself and evolving into something more tolerant of personal opinions, and questioning internet-sourced information. Or, from another perspective, the only alternative is that only some people can do that. (E.g. politicians, security services, etc) I'm not sure that would be preferable.

Choosing to be at the mercy of the people with the best opsec instead of the government sure is a take. EDIT: I mean “in addition to the government”.

I’m sorry. I really meant “in addition to the government”.

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#162

Post by krainboltgreene »

NoImmatureAdHom wrote: post #76
ojnabieoot wrote: post #30

You can pretend to care about North Korean censorship all you want, but if you name your platform “Pepe,” positively cite 4chan as an influence, and take the time to criticize “cancel culture SJWs” then it’s quite clear what your intentions and motivations are, and who your audience is: you want to create a space run by and for racist pieces of garbage. You don’t actually care about free speech at all, and neither do…

It seems like you might have sympathies with the cancel-culture SJWs and oppose whatever this gal is behind. Rather than letting your emotions run wild, perhaps asking questions and thinking carefully might make more sense. For instance, foremost in my thoughts is the question: to what extent do makers of effective open-source tools have any control over how they're used? Popularity for Pepe might mean use by progres…

> Rather than letting your emotions run wild, perhaps asking questions and thinking carefully might make more sense.

That's incredibly presumptuous of you to the point of being very rude.

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#163

Post by falcolas »

cmeacham98 wrote: post #14
chrissnell wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We should tolerate all speech. That doesn't mean you can't scream and call it hate speech, but do so from your own platform.

What about libel/slander? What about child pornography? What about doxxing? Surely you agree we have to draw the line _somewhere_, even if you disagree with where we currently draw it?

> What about child pornography?

It's amusing how frequently this comes up. If someone distributes child pornography, arrest them using the existing laws of the land.

"But what if it spreads from there?" I hear someone saying. Well, they're still posting illegal content, so arrest them too.

It's silly to assume that the freedom of speech implies some kind of inherent free pass from consequences of your speech.

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#164

Post by spanktheuser »

tone wrote: post #97
AgentOrange1234 wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about: drumming up hatred and demonizing people has a long history of terrible consequences, e.g., rwanda, nazi germany, kkk, ...

You make a good point but you can't in the long term fight against this in a healthy way by stifling peoples access to information. Some people seem to hold the worldview that they know the right answers and must protect the simpletons from the wrong ones, where others would like to make all information available and trust in people to eventually form sensible solutions.

It’s interesting how people like the OP single out the two cures for the diseases of hatred & oppression: censorship and cancellation. And yet lack the courage to couch their ask in plain language: Let us say anything we want but never face any consequence for doing so.

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#165

Post by sodality2 »

encom wrote: post #141
GeoffreyPlitt wrote: post #132

Only election-truthers and violence peddlers get scared when Twitter deplatforms election-truthers and violence peddlers. As far as I can tell, serious conservatives haven't been touched. Watch as Trump supporters use every logical fallacy in the book to avoid this fact.

>serious conservatives haven't been touched Are you familiar with former american president Donald J. Trump? EDIT: And now I'm banned from posting. Thanks HN. Sorry I don't agree with your hive mind.

>Only election-truthers and violence peddlers

Did you read the parent comment?

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#166

Post by giveexamples »

cmeacham98 wrote: post #149
nostromo wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having tolerance for speech we don’t agree with does not mean we need to tolerate harassment, eviction, or termination. You may argue that free speech may lead to intolerant laws and actions - but history suggests the direct opposite: free speech has mostly expanded tolerance. And it makes sense: we have gay rights as a result of free expression. For the longest time the “offensive” idea being censored was that being…

Are those not forms of speech? Also, again, what about speech that only indirectly affects you? What if my speech is "I do not think gay people deserve the same human rights as straight people, and I want the government to deny them those rights"? I'm not saying it to you, I'm saying it to my elected representative(s) in the government. Should we tolerate that speech? Additionally, I believe that history supports my…

I have no doubt that shaming people with bad opinions will make them stop these opinions, at least in public. However I assume that you are the right person to judge 'bad' opinions?

If not you individually, maybe should select certain group of people to represent the people and create rules to enforce bad behavior is stopped?

Maybe we can call this body a government and call the rules laws.

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#167

Post by giveexamples »

ccortes wrote: post #87

Ok so according to this you can't delete anything. What happens then if I want to delete something I posted previously? Is it free speech if I want to retract something posted by myself but I'm not able to do so? Is it really free speech if a comment can't be altered/deleted by the owner of it?

I guess as long as profiles are talking heads it's fine since there's little consequence.

If you want to post offensive material to some people/governments you need to work hard to stay anonymous, like the reporter example where they recommend using a public eg library place to connect.

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#168

Post by mieses »

krainboltgreene wrote: post #162
NoImmatureAdHom wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like you might have sympathies with the cancel-culture SJWs and oppose whatever this gal is behind. Rather than letting your emotions run wild, perhaps asking questions and thinking carefully might make more sense. For instance, foremost in my thoughts is the question: to what extent do makers of effective open-source tools have any control over how they're used? Popularity for Pepe might mean use by progres…

> Rather than letting your emotions run wild, perhaps asking questions and thinking carefully might make more sense. That's incredibly presumptuous of you to the point of being very rude.

Presumably you're ok with "you want to create a space run by and for racist pieces of garbage".

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#169

Post by cmeacham98 »

giveexamples wrote: post #166
cmeacham98 wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are those not forms of speech? Also, again, what about speech that only indirectly affects you? What if my speech is "I do not think gay people deserve the same human rights as straight people, and I want the government to deny them those rights"? I'm not saying it to you, I'm saying it to my elected representative(s) in the government. Should we tolerate that speech? Additionally, I believe that history supports my…

I have no doubt that shaming people with bad opinions will make them stop these opinions, at least in public. However I assume that you are the right person to judge 'bad' opinions? If not you individually, maybe should select certain group of people to represent the people and create rules to enforce bad behavior is stopped? Maybe we can call this body a government and call the rules laws.

Where did I claim that I was the right person to judge this for all of society? I make these choices for myself by choosing what types of people I associate with, and I am a tiny part of making this decision for society at large by voting.

In my opinion, society is more tolerant when we do not let the intolerant people hijack it to spread intolerance. In other words, intolerance is some of that "bad behavior" that should at least be softly prevented. I am expressing this opinion on this discussion board in the hope that other people will agree with me and maybe even change their minds slightly (or maybe I'll have my mind changed instead!).

Re: Frustrated with Parler deplatforming, I am building a service no one can silence

#170

Post by throaway123456 »

loceng wrote: post #66
drusepth wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>What is fundamentally different with Pepe is moderation. Instead of relying on a centralized entity with a banhammer, each board and thread owner may anonymously moderate their spaces on their own. However, nothing can actually be deleted, it can only be shadowed, and each user decides whether they want to see the light or the full version of the page at any moment in time. People can still reply to shadowed posts i…

Inevitably I think bad or bad faith actors, the kind who were on Parler or in /r/Conservative that ban people with a counter-narrative will simply not use the platforms where they can't have full control to completely silence anyone they please. It's why I'm fairly certain giving bad actors "free" access to the best technology is nonsense, you wouldn't give enemies your plans to your latest technological advances in…

> Yes, it possibly inflamed some - but they quickly learned if you don't behave within the bounds of what's considered civilized behaviour...

What’s happens when the newspeak shifts and you or your family gets targeted like this?

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