Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

UK to launch taxpayer-funded high-risk tech research agency exempt from FOI

thetimes.co.uk

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

41–50 of 210 posts

Re: UK to launch taxpayer-funded high-risk tech research agency exempt from FOI

#41

Post by motohagiography »

jdavis703 wrote: post #17
motohagiography wrote: post #12

I still don't see how any government granting committee can outperform hundreds of private venture funds competing for exposure to new opportunities. Even if you have a government dept. of 10x geniuses, they don't scale to compete with a healthy investment community. As described, the risks I see are that, it has the incentives for a patronage slush fund, there will be selection bias to hedge political risk around pe…

The internet came out of a US government funded “advanced research projects agency.” It took decades before VCs monetized that research.

The Roman empire created roads, but we don't attribute railroads and cars to them. I think "government spending invented the internet," is the "you like roads, dontcha?" of our time. ARPA wasn't open ended research either, it was to respond to the existential threat of nuclear annihilation. Conflating public largess with national defence spending is a category error. Not to belabour it, but I do think this trope needs to be put to bed.

How should government fund basic vs. moonshot research? Incentives. If they think they are smart enough to allocate funds via a committee, they need to be smart enough to figure out how to structure incentives.

Re: UK to launch taxpayer-funded high-risk tech research agency exempt from FOI

#42

Post by dragonwriter »

jack_riminton wrote: post #30

If its our answer to DARPA then good. I only hope the money will be disbursed in ways similar to the DARPA challenges and not in the usual chronyist way of the UK There's a shocking number of people high up in UK tech influence circles who got there solely by networking, holding events and being on the peripheries of successful startups

Yes, it's a good thing the US in general, it's government more specifically, and it's defense establishment particularly are completely free of cronyism, and there aren't huge numbers of people influential in every field even loosely associated with the US’s vast military-industrial complex that have gotten their by networking rather than any other form of merit.

Re: UK to launch taxpayer-funded high-risk tech research agency exempt from FOI

#43

Post by hkt »

The exemption to FOIA is because the press and civic society in the UK have rooted out cronyism and corruption with gusto in the last year. The conservative party does not believe we have the right to know how we are being governed or who benefits from the process of government.

It makes me furious, and it should make you furious too, reader.

Re: UK to launch taxpayer-funded high-risk tech research agency exempt from FOI

#44

Post by jack_riminton »

nivenkos wrote: post #37
jack_riminton wrote: post #30

If its our answer to DARPA then good. I only hope the money will be disbursed in ways similar to the DARPA challenges and not in the usual chronyist way of the UK There's a shocking number of people high up in UK tech influence circles who got there solely by networking, holding events and being on the peripheries of successful startups

> There's a shocking number of people high up in UK tech influence circles who got there solely by networking, holding events and being on the peripheries of successful startups Like Boris Johnson's lover.

Ah yes, she set up a co-working space, held some events and launched (although presumably not heavily involved) in launching a White Hat consultancy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jennifer_Arcuri

Similar to Rohan Silva who advised Cameron; set up a co-working space, is on many boards, speaks at a lot of events

Re: UK to launch taxpayer-funded high-risk tech research agency exempt from FOI

#45

Post by cj »

bko wrote: post #29
jdavis703 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The internet came out of a US government funded “advanced research projects agency.” It took decades before VCs monetized that research.

Finance was very immature industry at that time. There wasn't a lot of money in private investment funds and the investment vehicles to capitalize on this research didn't yet exist. Today's private market would likely seize on an opportunity like the internet. There is appetite for long term focus in today's investors. Just look at PE (price-earnings) ratios of today's stocks, and the frothy revenue multiples in valu…

Most VC funds have an expected lifespan of (roughly) 10 years. Some longer, some shorter.

If your VC makes an investment 2 years into the fund, the expected return must come within 8 years if it's a 10 year fund.

I guess it comes down to what we consider "long term". If "long term" means 5-10 years, then the VC model works.

But if "long term" means 10-25 years or longer, the VC model becomes an unrealistic financing option.

Re: UK to launch taxpayer-funded high-risk tech research agency exempt from FOI

#48

Post by tschellenbach »

Basic research (IE things that are not monetizable in the near(ish) term) don't get anywhere near enough funding. Companies do a great job taking things from 1% to 100. There is a funding gap for the first bit.

A solution is definitely needed for that, I don't think a government funded agency will do it though.

Re: UK to launch taxpayer-funded high-risk tech research agency exempt from FOI

#49

Post by raverbashing »

motohagiography wrote: post #41
jdavis703 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The internet came out of a US government funded “advanced research projects agency.” It took decades before VCs monetized that research.

The Roman empire created roads, but we don't attribute railroads and cars to them. I think "government spending invented the internet," is the "you like roads, dontcha?" of our time. ARPA wasn't open ended research either, it was to respond to the existential threat of nuclear annihilation. Conflating public largess with national defence spending is a category error. Not to belabour it, but I do think this trope need…

"Incentives"

50 years (give or take) and with a lot of government help yet did we have private space exploration.

How many medical companies sat on their hands and have not pursued a covid treatment of vaccines?

The free market can't solve everything.

Governments (or more specifically, countries) don't have the existential threat incentive that companies have.

Re: UK to launch taxpayer-funded high-risk tech research agency exempt from FOI

#50

Post by [deleted] »

jack_riminton wrote: post #30

If its our answer to DARPA then good. I only hope the money will be disbursed in ways similar to the DARPA challenges and not in the usual chronyist way of the UK There's a shocking number of people high up in UK tech influence circles who got there solely by networking, holding events and being on the peripheries of successful startups

[deleted]
Post reply on HN