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Launch HN: Chorus Meditation (YC W21) – Meditation for Non-Meditators

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Re: Launch HN: Chorus Meditation (YC W21) – Meditation for Non-Meditators

#91

Post by codr7 »

cercatrova wrote: post #75
andrei_says_ wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What we call Yoga in the west is mostly appropriation. The rest is misunderstanding because the concept does not fit in thinking western minds. The best we get is what tae bo is to professional boxing. Source: conversations and experiences with someone who had the fortune to study both in New Delhi yoga university and with a Yoga lineage in the Himalayas. The official university still didn’t touch, or know, of essent…

What practices specifically in yoga do you speak of? I honestly appreciate that people in the west have secularized both yoga and meditation, as I personally find no value in the spiritual aspects and only find value in the exercise in the case of yoga and helping psychologically in the case of meditation. I'm curious to hear your perspective though, it seems to be different from mine.

Yoga is a spiritual practice, the fundamental goal is realizing your true (non-physical) self.

The physical exercises started out as conditioning to be able to sit longer in meditation, which is how you get there.

Re: Launch HN: Chorus Meditation (YC W21) – Meditation for Non-Meditators

#92

Post by lonesword »

mathemagical wrote: post #85
scpedicini wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we as a species didn't "culturally appropriate", the world would be hundreds of years behind in terms of progress. Invention itself is built on the idea of taking pre-existing concepts, combining and adapting them in new contexts. The idea that you can't borrow some existing body of knowledge because it's inherently sacrosanct and cannot be divided is just patently absurd.

Cultural appropriation refers to the use of objects or elements of a non-dominant culture in a way that doesn't respect their original meaning, give credit to their source, or reinforces stereotypes or contributes to oppression. - Google The problem here is not invention. The problem here is that aliabramovitz and company "like to stay away from those [theological] aspects as it can be off putting for people who don'…

> The problem here is not invention. The problem here is that aliabramovitz and company "like to stay away from those [theological] aspects as it can be off putting for people who don't subscribe to a certain philosophy or theology", in a subject matter where the original theology is a core part of it, and that too a theology that is not aliabramovitz's own theology in order to cater to people who dislike the theology of the original owners of the practice.

And as an Indian who used to practice Yoga as a child (too boring for me now) I'd say that this is completely fine. If the theological aspect was indeed crucial for deriving value from the whole experience, people would eventually lose interest because they wouldn't be gaining anything from the aliabramovitz's venture right?

Isn't it enough to see that a garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?[1]

[1] Quote by Douglas Adams

Re: Launch HN: Chorus Meditation (YC W21) – Meditation for Non-Meditators

#93

Post by jbob2000 »

tabulatouch wrote: post #82
cercatrova wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What practices specifically in yoga do you speak of? I honestly appreciate that people in the west have secularized both yoga and meditation, as I personally find no value in the spiritual aspects and only find value in the exercise in the case of yoga and helping psychologically in the case of meditation. I'm curious to hear your perspective though, it seems to be different from mine.

Yoga in the west is an effective stretching technique, with inspiring names and imaginary. So, very good indeed, but nothing to do with the source.

It’s awful for stretching, it doesn’t isolate muscles very well and strains joints. If it was good for stretching, you’d see NFL and MLB players doing it on the field before their games. It’s a ridiculous, roundabout way to do something that science has figured out can be done much quicker and easier, with less risk to the body.

It’s just a vain feel good activity. Yoga practitioners talk all about their “practice” and improving themselves through their “practice”. You’ll hear yoga studios say stuff like “don’t go to church, just do yoga!”. There’s a bunch of pride wrapped up in getting the poses right, but this doesn’t benefit your body, it just lets you one-up on other people because your pose is “more correct”.

Re: Launch HN: Chorus Meditation (YC W21) – Meditation for Non-Meditators

#94

Post by jbob2000 »

dolgo wrote: post #72
andrei_says_ wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What we call Yoga in the west is mostly appropriation. The rest is misunderstanding because the concept does not fit in thinking western minds. The best we get is what tae bo is to professional boxing. Source: conversations and experiences with someone who had the fortune to study both in New Delhi yoga university and with a Yoga lineage in the Himalayas. The official university still didn’t touch, or know, of essent…

Yoga laptops are actually made by a Chinese company, which most people consider to be in the ‘east’. How does that fit into your idea of western appropriation?

Quite beautifully actually. I’m going to use this laptop on some Swedish furniture, wearing my indigenous moccasins, while watching a western anime, eating California roll sushi and drinking an americano from a Starbucks.

Re: Launch HN: Chorus Meditation (YC W21) – Meditation for Non-Meditators

#96

Post by kritiko »

jbob2000 wrote: post #93
tabulatouch wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yoga in the west is an effective stretching technique, with inspiring names and imaginary. So, very good indeed, but nothing to do with the source.

It’s awful for stretching, it doesn’t isolate muscles very well and strains joints. If it was good for stretching, you’d see NFL and MLB players doing it on the field before their games. It’s a ridiculous, roundabout way to do something that science has figured out can be done much quicker and easier, with less risk to the body. It’s just a vain feel good activity. Yoga practitioners talk all about their “practice” a…

There’s not strong evidence-based support for stretching.

NFL and MLB players do tons of stuff like cupping or wearing magnets that are questionable. Doing yoga because it makes you feel accomplished seems about as harmless as channeling your ego into any sport or physical pursuit.

Re: Launch HN: Chorus Meditation (YC W21) – Meditation for Non-Meditators

#97

Post by carapace »

dang wrote: post #70
carapace wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Come now, I love that you know about all this stuff and as someone who used to order Esalen catalogs as a teenager, I share your fascination with it—but this is an extreme stretch. These guys aren't doing orgone therapy, rebirthings, or (heaven help us) immortality. Yeah, I think I overreacted. I've had friends who lost their minds doing weird things in irresponsible ways and I think I pattern-matched badly here. >…

I can't resist going further offtopic! Apologies to the thread. > Before that he was a scientific genius, and then, almost from that moment, he seems to descend into madness I'm not sure. With Reich, everyone picks the point at which they get off the train—almost no one is willing to ride all the way to the end with him. But people pick different points at which to bail. For some it is when he broke with Freud around…

Wow, you do know your stuff Dan G. I tip my hat to you sir. I love that you're fascinated by this stuff too. :)

FWIW, I was 110% Reich for a long time (UFOs too, why not? He's obviously one of the intellectual titans of his age, I wasn't there, who am I to second guess him?) but then I read a particular biography (it's in storage and I don't recall the title or author, sorry, but it was sympathetic to Reich) and it seemed to me that he became irrational after what he called "the Oranur Experiment". I found a site that seems to have a description: https://stillnessinthestorm.com/2013/08/orgone-energy-neutra...

I have no idea what really happened, of course, but I suspect he injured himself somehow experimenting with radium and "orgone".

Even if you set aside the fight with the UFOs, his response to the FDA seems crazy (to me) even for someone who was literally persecuted for much of his professional career. The actions of the FDA don't seem quite so egregious in light of the personal fight Reich picked with ... crap I can't recall now, some bigwig in the FDA, or a federal Judge, someone like that who took it personally, and that's how he wound up serving two years in prison. They still shouldn't have burned his papers, that's messed up. And his end is deeply tragic. But was doing things like refusing a lawyer, representing himself, insisting that the authorities read his books, and that they had no authority over him. Ah, it makes me sad.

I sometimes wonder what an alternate history would be like where Reich and his work took root in Vienna and grew into ... who knows what?

I'm curious dang, if you don't mind me asking, where do you fall out of the funnel on Reich? And on "woo-woo" in general? What's you metaphysical story like? :) Where does the sidewalk end?

- - - -

That Kate Bush video! Wow, LOL, Yay! I'll see that and raise you Gurdjieff's Fourth Way embedded in the middle of "Meaning of Life" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2QJvc_SxFQ

Re: Launch HN: Chorus Meditation (YC W21) – Meditation for Non-Meditators

#98

Post by solaceb »

aliabramovitz wrote: post #64
marc_io wrote: post #61

I find it a little problematic when these ancient practices are separated from their broader context. There are further, unknown implications by doing so. It is similar to what was done with what we call "Yoga" here in the west. I am not saying that these practices cannot evolve, they must. But they are certainly part of a tradition that has been coherently applied and studied for centuries. In my opinion the result…

Thank you so much for your feedback! We like to stay away from those aspects as it can be off putting for people who don't subscribe to a certain philosophy or theology. We, instead try to make more approachable for everyone where you don't need to believe in anything other than spreading kindness to yourself and others. We certainly pay homage to where the traditions come from when we talk about the practice, for ex…

Right, spreading kindness, and also you'll just happen to make quite a lot of money

Re: Launch HN: Chorus Meditation (YC W21) – Meditation for Non-Meditators

#99

Post by andrei_says_ »

codr7 wrote: post #91
cercatrova wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What practices specifically in yoga do you speak of? I honestly appreciate that people in the west have secularized both yoga and meditation, as I personally find no value in the spiritual aspects and only find value in the exercise in the case of yoga and helping psychologically in the case of meditation. I'm curious to hear your perspective though, it seems to be different from mine.

Yoga is a spiritual practice, the fundamental goal is realizing your true (non-physical) self. The physical exercises started out as conditioning to be able to sit longer in meditation, which is how you get there.

What if the “physical” exercises included aspects that qualitatively changed the state of one’s mind in ways that cannot be contained by thinking and thus cannot be expressed by language?

Re: Launch HN: Chorus Meditation (YC W21) – Meditation for Non-Meditators

#100

Post by codr7 »

andrei_says_ wrote: post #99
codr7 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yoga is a spiritual practice, the fundamental goal is realizing your true (non-physical) self. The physical exercises started out as conditioning to be able to sit longer in meditation, which is how you get there.

What if the “physical” exercises included aspects that qualitatively changed the state of one’s mind in ways that cannot be contained by thinking and thus cannot be expressed by language?

Sure, and that goes for all internal experiences.

In the ashram where I stayed we weren't even allowed to talk about the practice.

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