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MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

reuters.com

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Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#541

Post by wuliwong »

raiyu wrote: post #193
olalonde wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin is used as a speculative investment today only because it is so underpriced. Once its value stabilizes, its use in day to day transactions will grow. > Should also note that MasterCard crypto transactions almost certainly won’t be settled on the blockchain. And neither are USD transactions. In fact, USD doesn't even have a blockchain! The great thing with Bitcoin is once you want to cash out your Bitcoin, you…

Bitcoin is used as a speculative instrument because by definition it is deflationary. Which means it is more expensive to buy something with it today, then tomorrow. Just look at Chamath's tweet about how he bought a property for Bitcoin in 2014 for $1.4MM but today that same amount of bitcoin would be $100MM+ https://markets.businessinsider.com/currencies/news/chamath-... This creates an environment there is never a…

It is only by definition deflationary if you are specifically talking about price deflation. I know that has grown to be the popular use of the term but inflation/deflation is much better defined by the increase/decrease in the supply itself. By that definition, BTC is still inflationary for the near future until it hits the 21 million BTC limit. It's just far less inflationary than USD.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#542

Post by PragmaticPulp »

solosoyokaze wrote: post #512
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #502

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't need to track down every transaction. You just need to flag the fraudulent/stolen/illegal coins on the blockchain and require exchanges to confiscate those coins as they come through the system. Blockchain is a public ledger of every Bitcoin transaction ever. It's trivial to track these things. It's trivial to identify downstream coins from upstream illegal activity. Far easier than with traditional currenc…

The exchanges are becoming decentralized. Not just exchanges but other financial services, including the ability to earn interest. There are also other coins that are less traceable than BTC. It's only going to get more difficult for governments to track crypto, not less.

If all you care about is crypto and you're happy to use exchanges that don't care about regulations, that works.

But if you want to get money back out of the system or spend that money on anything, it has to go through an exchange located in your jurisdiction.

Also, watch out for the services that claim to deliver abnormally high interest on crypto investments. There's no free lunch.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#543

Post by ketamine__ »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #474
Shoue wrote: post #375

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The incentive is the exact thing you're worried about: merchants get to avoid fees. If Nano ever takes off as a payment method, then you'd probably see e.g. large grocery chains operating Nano nodes to avoid fees.

Cool. But why not just use the nano technology with a USD-backed currency instead? Cut out all of the alternative currency speculation and just let the technology do the work on people's money.

Like USDC.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#544

Post by nemo44x »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #496
lifty wrote: post #404

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think the code will fail, the consensus model, or there are no uses cases? If you have concerns about this I would love to hear them. But if you are only afraid that the price can fall 90%, then who cares? Let it fall, there is too much hype anyway, to the point it has created great division between coiners and no-coiners. For example, the 2001 stock market crash, it cleared out projects based on fluff and the…

Ask yourself: What drives the price increase? Are people buying because they expect to use Bitcoin? Or because they expect the price will go up? If it's the latter, it's a self-reinforcing cycle: The price goes up because people buy. People buy because the price goes up. So what happens when the popular narrative switches? What happens when the price goes down for years at a time and people watch their money dwindle?…

The price did go down for about a couple years and here we are today. I think if anything people are more likely to buy the dips and see it as a buying opportunity rather than a reason to.

So what drives the increase in price? Many reasons. Because it's going up? Sure, that's accounts for some. It's a store of value against a government that printed 22% of all dollars ever created last year? Yeah. In a world that seems increasingly chaotic and unpredictable in places that always seemed stable it is attractive because it's a global store of value that can be tapped if you ever have to flee? Sure.

I think these are just a few reasons why it's going up in value. It's quite scarce and everyone knows the rules and no one controls it. Not a government, a corporation, or a person. So yeah, it can and probably will take hits but I think in the long run it's just a thing that makes a lot of sense to more and more people as part of a well diversified portfolio.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#545

Post by PragmaticPulp »

qqii wrote: post #535
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #483

Earlier quoted context omitted.

#2 (crypto transactions backed by traditional currency) is far and away the most useful of these categories. Unfortunately, it doesn't offer the speculative upside of something like Bitcoin. People don't actually care if their transactions are carried across a blockchain or a database, as long as it gets done. Bitcoin is hot specifically because it's so detached from any real-world use cases or metrics that might put…

Pegged tokens like USDC and USDC can still be used to speculate in DeFi platform like AAVE with pretty lucrative returns.

Where do the returns come from?

Does the interest return come from actual investments? Or is it paid forward by newcomers? The latter is the literal definition of a ponzi scheme.

There's no free lunch when it comes to generating interest.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#546

Post by X6S1x6Okd1st »

ArtTimeInvestor wrote: post #4

The game Paypal currently plays with Crypto is the closest thing to printing money I have ever seen: Their users can "buy and sell Bitcoin" and pay "no fees". How does Paypal make money? "From the spread". The difference between bid and ask. And who sets the spread? Drumroll ... Paypal! Since you cannot transfer your bitcoins out, when you sell your bitcoins, Paypal pays you whatever they like. So far, Paypal only of…

MasterCard is only allowing stablecoins. Your insight sounds good, but unrelated to this.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#547

Post by tboyd47 »

It's important for people to read the actual press release: https://mstr.cd/3tLaPZM There's good info here which will be new info to many.

Why did they do this? It turns out that about a third of Nigerians report using or holding cryptocurrency (!). https://www.statista.com/chart/18345/crypto-currency-adoptio... Second place are Vietnam and the Phillipines. For all, the #1 reason was for remittances.

Haven't we all had it drilled into our heads by CNBC and the likes that crypto was nothing but a big speculative bubble? Woops, I guess that was a big lie.

> Users will also benefit from Wirex’s Cryptoback™ rewards program, which automatically gives customers up to 1.5% back in Bitcoin for every purchase made in-store.

It does appear that they will support transfers to external wallets (!), contrary to what has been claimed elsewhere in this thread -> https://wirexapp.com/help/article/how-do-i-transfer-cryptocu...

The card is not yet available to US customers, although, apparently it is in the works -> https://news.bitcoin.com/wirex-launching-us-after-receiving-...

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#548

Post by elyobo »

vbezhenar wrote: post #255
systemvoltage wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the point of an unstable, volatile, frantically manipulated currency that is susceptible to social media pump and dump schemes (Elon + Doge)? Currency and its exchange rate needs to be relatively stable for the world to put trust into it. Saying that BTC is stable, but the rest of the world's fiat currency is fluctuating makes no sense. US dollar provides stability and security, I feel confident that a cappucc…

Your view must be skewed by privilege of having stable currency. Currency of my country lost 250% of its value over last 7 years. It's not bitcoin-level volatile, but close to it. Thankfully I have an option to use USD to hoard money, but that option is not something that's given, in many countries you just can't exchange for fair price. I agree that for someone living in US or EU there's no much point using BTC.

I'm not sure what you mean by "lost 250% of its value" - that seems impossible, so I guess something has been lost in translation! Can you clarify?

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#549

Post by BenoitEssiambre »

sgeisler wrote: post #513
BenoitEssiambre wrote: post #440

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The pre ww1 world was probably too different from today to draw lessons applicable today and in any case there were recessions every few years back then: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_recessions_in_the_Unit... Gold tied assets hoarding caused the great depression.

Probably an unpopular opinion on a VC site, but to some degree recessions are good and needed to weed out underperforming and utterly useless companies to free up resources. The lack of such and bail-outs/rescuing attempts by governments to "save jobs" [1] have delayed necessary restructuring for way too long. Also, if recessions are the norm rather than the exception I'd expect people and companies to be more prepar…

Except low aggregate demand recessions do no such thing. It's often the opposite. Recessions keep alive inefficient manual labor intensive, low tech service industries because they make available cheap unemployed/underemployed labor. That's on top of the inefficiency of people doing nothing and living off of unemployment benefit/welfare.

Under performing companies get much more efficiently "creatively destructed" in an economy that is running hot where only the more efficient, well tooled businesses can afford employees at tight labor market wages. On top of this, fewer human resources are left wastefully idle.

Re: MasterCard to open up network to cryptocurrencies

#550

Post by strangeattractr »

kungito wrote: post #114
systemvoltage wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the point of an unstable, volatile, frantically manipulated currency that is susceptible to social media pump and dump schemes (Elon + Doge)? Currency and its exchange rate needs to be relatively stable for the world to put trust into it. Saying that BTC is stable, but the rest of the world's fiat currency is fluctuating makes no sense. US dollar provides stability and security, I feel confident that a cappucc…

But did you ever wonder where the stability of USD comes from? It all comes down to how big the transaction volume of your currency is. Things like "Petrodollar" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petrodollar_recycling#Petrodol... increase the volume and provide additional stability. As "market cap" of bitcoin increases, so does the stability. All things considered, bitcoin still is very bad because of the transaction thr…

I've always wondered why people are so obsessed with petrodollar recycling? The USD has been a global reserve currency since the 1920s and superseded the GBP completely post-Bretton Woods. The petrodollar mechanism is not what caused the USD to be stable nor a safe haven asset. It's because the US has strong property rights, deep and liquid capital markets, a large and diverse economy and most importantly is willing to absorb the financial flows associated with being the reserve currency (mercantilist economies will not accept the appreciation these bring).
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