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Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index

cbeci.org

531–540 of 1001 posts

Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index

#531
post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Bitcoin is now considered by some important for our future finance system Yeah, but those people are wrong. It's perfectly reasonable to judge them for doing harmful actions in service of a wrong belief.

Beliefs that used to be "wrong" and now are considered right: abolitionism, homosexuality, marijuana. How do you know this is a wrong belief that will stay wrong?

I don't know for certain, of course; I just very strongly suspect it.

Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index

#532
post #518

At that rate and assuming 4tx per second a single Bitcoin transaction consumes 165kWh. A Tesla battery is bit over 50kWh. So let's round that to 3 full charges of Tesla battery. That's 350km/220 miles of range per charge. In total 1050km or 660 miles of driving. So basically if you want to transfer money and the recipient is closer than 660 miles from you it's more efficient to just get a bunch of bills, drive there…

And the cost of an off-chain transaction? Actually, you're right, that's not worth mentioning because that doesn't fit with your argument.

Well that would be double, as you have to set up and tear down the lightning channel with a transaction for each operation...

Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index

#533

At that rate and assuming 4tx per second a single Bitcoin transaction consumes 165kWh. A Tesla battery is bit over 50kWh. So let's round that to 3 full charges of Tesla battery. That's 350km/220 miles of range per charge. In total 1050km or 660 miles of driving. So basically if you want to transfer money and the recipient is closer than 660 miles from you it's more efficient to just get a bunch of bills, drive there…

Nobody ever said that Bitcoin was a efficient system. It has other qualities that worth it.

Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index

#534
post #332

How much energy does watching porn consume? Playing video games? Watching a movie? Browsing Facebook? Using a ski chair? Visiting an amusement park? Going in vacation? Cooking your favorite type of food? Making ice cream? Driving to your friends? Listening to music? Concerts? Having a party? Banking? Casinos? As a species we use energy to meet our goals. Those goals may be situated anywhere in our hierarchy of needs.…

I mean it's just a standard economic argument concerning the use of scarce resources. All your examples have a higher impact on the real economy vs. Bitcoin. As in, these industries employ large numbers of people and sustain economic growth to some degree, in contrast Bitcoin services a comparatively limited population engaged in limited productive activity relative to its energy use.

People are free to be judgmental about anything they like.

Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index

#535
post #247
post #7

Question that came to mind after reading the headline: could this become a future reason for governments to criminalise the trading / use of Bitcoin because of negative environmental effects? On the surface it seems the value of Bitcoin is directly tied to its energy consumption and thus environmental harm. I get that Bitcoin itself is decentralised and cannot be banned outright. But could it be neutered in such a wa…

I was thinking exactly the same. I would be in favor tbh. If the government is allowed to dictate how my car must be built in order to make it more environmentally friendly, I don't see why it shouldn't be able to dictate how my blockchain must be built in order to make it environmentally sustainable. This wouldn't mean banning blockchain altogether. It would entail banning only those forms of distributed consensus t…

Government regulation should focus on how electricity is produced, not how electricity is used. If Bitcoin created pollution or dumped toxic chemicals, I would agree with you. But Bitcoin doesn't do either of those things, the power plants do those things.

So save your regulations for the power plants and let the market figure out how to spend the electricity. If you wouldn't be in favor of the government regulating how much money can be spent on beef, or how much money can be spent on TVs, you shouldn't be in favor of the government regulating how much can be spent on Bitcoin's electricity bills.

Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index

#536
post #332

How much energy does watching porn consume? Playing video games? Watching a movie? Browsing Facebook? Using a ski chair? Visiting an amusement park? Going in vacation? Cooking your favorite type of food? Making ice cream? Driving to your friends? Listening to music? Concerts? Having a party? Banking? Casinos? As a species we use energy to meet our goals. Those goals may be situated anywhere in our hierarchy of needs.…

> Bitcoin is now considered by some important for our future finance system. Really? give us a source, one who isn't either a grifter, a shill, or a criminal.

Does it count if they're all three?

Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index

#537
post #332

How much energy does watching porn consume? Playing video games? Watching a movie? Browsing Facebook? Using a ski chair? Visiting an amusement park? Going in vacation? Cooking your favorite type of food? Making ice cream? Driving to your friends? Listening to music? Concerts? Having a party? Banking? Casinos? As a species we use energy to meet our goals. Those goals may be situated anywhere in our hierarchy of needs.…

A maximum of 178 things on the planet consume >= to the electricity of Bitcoin.

99.44%/0.56% = ~178 according to their estimate. So if you want to compare, the premise is that there are no more than 178 things on Earth more valuable per watt, no more than 178 things to compare to... That is absurd.

Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index

#538

At that rate and assuming 4tx per second a single Bitcoin transaction consumes 165kWh. A Tesla battery is bit over 50kWh. So let's round that to 3 full charges of Tesla battery. That's 350km/220 miles of range per charge. In total 1050km or 660 miles of driving. So basically if you want to transfer money and the recipient is closer than 660 miles from you it's more efficient to just get a bunch of bills, drive there…

The downside of driving your tesla with a case full of bills is that there's no immutable world-wide distributed record of your transaction making it irreversible.

Well, it is irreversible to the extent giving any physical papers to another person is irreversible.

However, the upside of driving your Tesla with a case full of bills is that there's no immutable world-wide distributed record of your transaction making it irreversible.

Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index

#539

I like the fun-facts on this page: "The amount of electricity consumed every year by always-on but inactive home devices in the USA alone could power the Bitcoin network for 1.8 years" Where is the discussion about the smart home devices using that much energy? This is horrible, thats twice as the Bitcoin network and this is just the USA. I would really like if someone estimate the energy usage (with all trucks and c…

I’ve been getting ads from my power company about “energy vampires” reminding me to turn off or unplug unwanted devices for decades. There is an outrage about that wasted power; you’ve just missed it.

Oh, and we’re getting more efficient about household energy usage every single day. Those always on lights used to be 60W incandescent bulbs, now they’re 6-7W LEDs. The same cannot be said about the Bitcoin network, which is growing in energy consumption.

Re: Cambridge Bitcoin Electricity Consumption Index

#540
post #265

Ok, I have to admit that I am one of those people who knew about BTC very, very early but never bought any. Now, of course I should have mined at least 100 back in the days, but anyways. The reason I have never mined nor bought into it is that I still, to this day struggle to come up with a real reason to do so. Am I getting too old? Do I not see the "huge potential" what it may become? Don't I want to get freaking r…

Can you really not find a single use for bitcoin? Here is the most obvious one - true sovereignty over your capital. When you have bitcoin, you have have physical ownership of a digitally transferable asset. Not legal ownership where a custodian ultimately decides whether you can access it. In theory nothing prevents individuals from carrying entire national budgets as seed words in their heads. You can argue ethics,…

> Here is the most obvious one - true sovereignty over your capital. When you have bitcoin, you have have physical ownership of a digitally transferable asset. Not legal ownership where a custodian ultimately decides whether you can access it.

This isn't really true though. At the end of the day, you're always subject to the powers that be who will come knocking on your door with guns if you stop paying your taxes. If they criminalize BTC, stick you in jail, it won't really matter that you have "physical ownership of a digitally transferable asset". Ultimately there's always a custodian who decides whether you can access it.

It might currently have some small benefits over traditional currency (in terms of not needing to operate via the banking system) but that doesn't mean it's somehow outside the boundaries of traditional society.

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