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Europe's Vaccine Disaster

spiegel.de

401–410 of 434 posts

Re: Europe's Vaccine Disaster

#401

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s due to being a federation. The US is not the only federation; Australia, for example, is one too, and just like the US, in Australia public health is primarily a state responsibility, the federal government provides most of the funding but the states own the public hospitals and control most of the operational decisions. Yet I never heard any Australian compare foreign countries to Australian states. Other fed…

Going from Idaho to New York is about the same shock as going from Idaho to Australia. The people who make this comparison are the ones who have actually been to many different American states instead of just reading about them on Reddit.

There are some big differences between American states, yes. (I myself have been to a few, not Idaho though.)

But there are even bigger differences between Indian states. All American states share a common majority language (English). By contrast, in India, different states speak different languages, even completely unrelated ones (Indo-European vs Dravidian). Yet I've never heard an Indian compare countries to Indian states.

There is also a fair amount of diversity within Australia, even within the same state. Sydney is a buzzing worldly metropolis of over 5 million people, at the capital of the state of New South Wales. 1187 km northwest, but still in New South Wales, is the tiny town of Tibooburra, population 134, which I actually visited once with my parents when I was a teenager in the 1990s. I think the difference between Tibooburra and Sydney is at least as big as the difference between Idaho and New York.

Re: Europe's Vaccine Disaster

#402

Earlier quoted context omitted.

thats true. At least in Germany, you are just sent to the EU Parlament if you re not performing well in the country level.

The CDU is also the worst for trying to enforce their German politics through EU law. I am pro-EU, but I think the authoritarian countries (Poland, Hungary) need to be kicked out or at least punished. The EU states are too diverse right now in terms of values and economy. Hard to effectively lead such a bunch. I wish countries would send their best to the EU. We could get shit done. (tho, overall I am very happy with…

lol, by authoritarian you just mean "not leftist".

The UK is far more authoritarian than anywhere in Eastern Europe, arresting thousands of people for speech crime every year, refusing to allow the registration of opposition political parties, engaging in massive surveillance of the population, illegally jailing political dissidents etc etc. Did you advocate kicking us out?

No, of course not, because it's done in the cause of liberal globalism (people are jailed for saying things that offend left wing victim groups, the people surveilled are "right wing extremists", the parties refused registration are "far right", the dissidents jailed are "right wing populists" etc) so people like you have no problem with it.

I mean you literally advocate "punishing" countries that fail to submit to liberal leftist ideology, and say the EU needs more "shows of strength", you're not "anti-authoritarian, you're just a left wing authoritarian.

But yes, go ahead and kick them out, they'll be lucky to be free of the EU's subversion of their national cultures.

Re: Europe's Vaccine Disaster

#403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EU need those countries mainly because of cheap workforce, army and to create this buffer between Central Europe and Russia. EU cannot afford to loose the 8th strongest army of Europe and have it potentially getting aligned with Russia. It would be a disaster for Germany, to have Poland as enemy right now and have them doing military exercises together with Russia some km from the Germany/Poland border. Yes, Poland h…

> EU cannot afford to loose the 8th strongest army of Europe and have it potentially getting aligned with Russia. I very much doubt Poland would align with Russia. They hate them since forever. Poland should be given the choice to play by the law and value human rights or see what nationalism is worth without the EU. They won't leave. They will follow. They have much, much more to lose. > EU need those countries main…

liberalism is the definition of cultural degeneration lol.

Re: Europe's Vaccine Disaster

#404

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I very much doubt Poland would align with Russia. They hate them since forever. Germany and France were eternal enemies too. Now we cannot imagine Europe without both countries. If we kick Poland out of EU, the anti-EU sentiment will grow and Russia will be the only available partner in the region. At the same time Poland will have a strategic card in their hand. So they will do what they have to do. Look the numbe…

I am not advocating for "kicking poland out", but giving it a choice or rather impose penalties for it feasting on the imagery of EU as enemy and shit. Membership comes with rules Poland isn't following. Either get in line or get out. I am saying it's in Poland's interest to play along. Hungary on the other hand is probably fucked beyond at this point. > So IMO, you want to fight populism with populism and fight for…

> I am not advocating for "kicking poland out",

You literally wrote: "I am pro-EU, but I think the authoritarian countries (Poland, Hungary) need to be kicked out or at least punished."

Re: Europe's Vaccine Disaster

#405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The UK actually ordered that vaccine way before the EU, the UK essentially paid for manufacturing to start. EU didn't, and only ordered it after it was clear it would work. 3 months later than the UK. So astrazeneca started manufacturing doses in the UK 3 months ago, but the manufacturing teething problems in the EU factory are 3 months behind. Essentially the EU, at best, are trying to jump the queue, which is very…

Well... maybe not. What the EU suspects is that vaccine that was produced in the EU with EU money was shipped to the UK in December. I have read that even until last week shipments went from the EU to the UK. If so, AZ and/or the UK government are actively cheating the EU. Is it true? I guess time will tell. Good source for latest vaccine news: https://twitter.com/QuentinAries

The EU doesn't own everything in the EU, it's not the Soviet Union (much as people like you seem to want it to be).

They aren't "EU vaccines". Astra Zeneca can ship them wherever they want based on contractual and legal practices. Those are privately owned AstraZeneca facilities. The idea that you can separate out "EU money" within a private company is also ridiculous.

If the EU wants to start playing games then other countries and corporations will simply remove the EU from supply chains etc. Japan and South Korea for example trusted that normal contractual and legal practices would be followed when they ordered vaccines produced in the EU, and are now publicly stating their concern.

Do you think they'll ever trust the EU again if it tries to violate their contractual rights on the moronic grounds that "they were made in the EU therefore they belong to the EU"?

Re: Europe's Vaccine Disaster

#406
post #326
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No way UK is to blame for this, just pure arrogance of narcissistic EU commission trowing a temper tantrum about how it can't possibly be even wrong after having grabbed all responsibility for delivering the vaccine because it was her moment to shine after the brexit, and then start pointing fingers at the first set back.

No one blamed UK. This blame thing is completely made up by UK media.

lol, the EU is publicly doing it and there are people in this thread doing it.

Re: Europe's Vaccine Disaster

#407

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I very much doubt Poland would align with Russia. They hate them since forever. Germany and France were eternal enemies too. Now we cannot imagine Europe without both countries. If we kick Poland out of EU, the anti-EU sentiment will grow and Russia will be the only available partner in the region. At the same time Poland will have a strategic card in their hand. So they will do what they have to do. Look the numbe…

I am not advocating for "kicking poland out", but giving it a choice or rather impose penalties for it feasting on the imagery of EU as enemy and shit. Membership comes with rules Poland isn't following. Either get in line or get out. I am saying it's in Poland's interest to play along. Hungary on the other hand is probably fucked beyond at this point. > So IMO, you want to fight populism with populism and fight for…

> You mean the cultural diversity of authoritarianism, workers exploitation and human rights violations? Yes, I would like to kill that.

Your populism is awful. I know, Virtue Signaling is the best way to earn karma @ Reddit. Not here on HN, though..

Germany is exploiting the polish workers. So I guess Germany should be "kicked out" from EU for that?

Re: Europe's Vaccine Disaster

#408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not advocating for "kicking poland out", but giving it a choice or rather impose penalties for it feasting on the imagery of EU as enemy and shit. Membership comes with rules Poland isn't following. Either get in line or get out. I am saying it's in Poland's interest to play along. Hungary on the other hand is probably fucked beyond at this point. > So IMO, you want to fight populism with populism and fight for…

> I am not advocating for "kicking poland out", You literally wrote: "I am pro-EU, but I think the authoritarian countries (Poland, Hungary) need to be kicked out or at least punished."

> or at least punished

Re: Europe's Vaccine Disaster

#409

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The CDU is also the worst for trying to enforce their German politics through EU law. I am pro-EU, but I think the authoritarian countries (Poland, Hungary) need to be kicked out or at least punished. The EU states are too diverse right now in terms of values and economy. Hard to effectively lead such a bunch. I wish countries would send their best to the EU. We could get shit done. (tho, overall I am very happy with…

lol, by authoritarian you just mean "not leftist". The UK is far more authoritarian than anywhere in Eastern Europe, arresting thousands of people for speech crime every year, refusing to allow the registration of opposition political parties, engaging in massive surveillance of the population, illegally jailing political dissidents etc etc. Did you advocate kicking us out? No, of course not, because it's done in the…

> you're not "anti-authoritarian, you're just a left wing authoritarian.

Yes I was kind of avoiding this term, but you nailed it.

Re: Europe's Vaccine Disaster

#410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Going from Idaho to New York is about the same shock as going from Idaho to Australia. The people who make this comparison are the ones who have actually been to many different American states instead of just reading about them on Reddit.

That's not the point, but even if it was, you could also say something like going from Kiryas Joel to New York City is as big of a "shock" as going from Idaho to Australia, even though these two places are in the same state and 30km away. Yeah the U.S is big and varied, but that doesn't mean that the political and societal structures are approximately the same as the EU.

It's probably because before the United States existed, they were separate states. Then they became a confederacy (twice). There's also the open ended clause where Texas thinks they can secede if they want to.
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