Sales of electric cars up by 43% in 2020 • Hacker News Board

Re: Sales of electric cars up by 43% in 2020

#151

Post by mixmastamyk » Mon, Jan 25, 2021, 8:04 AM UTC

oblio wrote: post #118

paul7986 wrote: post #27

Can i get an electric car that I can go fill it's battery as fast as I can go fill my gasoline tank? That's when I'm getting one!

You're being downvoted because HN loves electric car, but for the layman, that's their thought process: 1. Does the EV cost as much as a regular car? Most of them are very expensive, comparatively, especially for cheap family cars. 2. Is the range comparable to regular cars? It's not, at similar prices it's 60%. 3. Is it trivial to recharge it, especially quickly? Not true for most of the world. 4. Can the car be bou…

It's not hard to see the trajectory however. I heard the same types of arguments against digital cameras. Ten years later film cameras barely exist.

Re: Sales of electric cars up by 43% in 2020

#152

Post by titanomachy » Mon, Jan 25, 2021, 8:05 AM UTC

theshrike79 wrote: post #125

chovybizzass wrote: post #4

I am going to buy a new car soon and I think it will be the last time gasoline will be available for me. I'm going 4x4 so there's not much EV options.

Depends on the type of 4x4 you want. If you're looking for the "I can go EVERYWHERE" type, then your options are a bit limited at the moment (Rivian, Cybertruck, Bollinger). For regular "I want better traction and pull a trailer" 4x4 you've got a bunch of options, mostly PHEV though.

Are any of those actually options "at the moment"? If I put a deposit on a Rivian or Cybertruck I have no idea when I would actually get to drive it, depends how many people are in line and whether their production lines ramp up on schedule. I can drive a Subaru off the lot today if I want.

Re: Sales of electric cars up by 43% in 2020

#153

Post by jillesvangurp » Mon, Jan 25, 2021, 8:06 AM UTC

angmarsbane wrote: post #17

One thing I keep getting tripped up on with EV cars is the usability during an emergency. I grew up in SoCal when there were rolling black-outs. Just this week, a windstorm took out my parent’s power for 3 days. I don’t view electricity to be as reliable as gas. What fact am I missing that can change my view on this?

How much is that irrational fear worth to you? In the end that's the question that needs answering. Very soon, you'll be paying extra to buy a petrol vehicle. And that's before you drive it anywhere and get to deal with taxes, fuel cost, and maintenance cost as well.

In any case, a typical EV would have about 50KWH of battery; more than enough to power a house for a while. The more EVs there are, the more stored KWH of energy will be around in any area if a blackout happens. Much more useful than oversized SUVs burning up all the remaining fuel in your area while fuel logistics are being disrupted.

For your parents, an EV and vehicle to grid technology could have seen them through those 3 days. More, if you drive it to some fast charging access point in between to top it up for 10$. It's perfect especially for remote setups. Add some solar panels to the mix and you are basically not dependent on the grid.

Re: Sales of electric cars up by 43% in 2020

#154

Post by Reason077 » Mon, Jan 25, 2021, 8:06 AM UTC

_ph_ wrote: post #112

godmode2019 wrote: post #81

'Global sales' I hope everyone understands in China it is very hard to get a licence plate, the government allows you to get a licence plate if you buy a heavily subsidised electric car. The aim is to stimulate demand to develop an industry. Large cities also banned motorbikes and scooters, with the same aim. This is no way market driven demand, BYD is a very interesting company to look into. It is my understanding t…

Electric car sales are up in Germany by similar amounts. Completely without any force applied. The same in many European countries.

There is “force being applied” in the form of EU fleet-wide emissions requirements.

Automakers must sell increasing numbers of full electric and/or hybrid vehicles in order to meet their emissions targets, otherwise they face potentially huge fines.

Re: Sales of electric cars up by 43% in 2020

#155

Post by franklampard » Mon, Jan 25, 2021, 8:08 AM UTC

godmode2019 wrote: post #81

'Global sales' I hope everyone understands in China it is very hard to get a licence plate, the government allows you to get a licence plate if you buy a heavily subsidised electric car. The aim is to stimulate demand to develop an industry. Large cities also banned motorbikes and scooters, with the same aim. This is no way market driven demand, BYD is a very interesting company to look into. It is my understanding t…

It might just be simply an environmental reason. The air quality has been intolerable and largely due to traffic

Re: Sales of electric cars up by 43% in 2020

#156

Post by titanomachy » Mon, Jan 25, 2021, 8:08 AM UTC

natch wrote: post #78

chovybizzass wrote: post #4

I am going to buy a new car soon and I think it will be the last time gasoline will be available for me. I'm going 4x4 so there's not much EV options.

Are you claiming that EVs don’t have AWD? My car begs to differ. Or...? Sorry I’m not versed on the finer points of 4x4 versus 4WD versus AWD terminology so maybe it’s me that’s confused, feel free to fill me in.

For me it was a matter of cost, there were lots of inexpensive used ICE cars with AWD but no electric ones. The cheapest AWD Tesla seems to be $47k new which is vastly more than most people spend on a car.

Re: Sales of electric cars up by 43% in 2020

#157

Post by throwawayzRUU6f » Mon, Jan 25, 2021, 8:09 AM UTC

clouddrover wrote: post #117

_ph_ wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Electric car sales are up in Germany by similar amounts. Completely without any force applied. The same in many European countries.

Car companies must meet the EU fleet emissions standards and the only way most car companies will achieve that is by selling BEVs. Volkswagen and Renault are the top two BEV makers in Europe. Toyota is in a good position with their fleet emissions because they've been selling hybrids for so long. They're not under as much pressure to start selling BEVs in high volumes.

Your first and second paragraph contradict each other. Even though Toyota doesn't offer a single BEV in their lineup, they are completely fine with the stricter emission standards.

Nobody is forcing anyone to sell BEVs, what is forced is efficiency. Full BEV is only one way to achieve that goal. Look at Hyundai Ioniq hybrid - a perfectly capable midsize family car, affordable, introduced to the market in 2017. It will meet emission standards all the way until 2029.

Re: Sales of electric cars up by 43% in 2020

#158

Post by Reason077 » Mon, Jan 25, 2021, 8:13 AM UTC

throwawayzRUU6f wrote: post #157

clouddrover wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Car companies must meet the EU fleet emissions standards and the only way most car companies will achieve that is by selling BEVs. Volkswagen and Renault are the top two BEV makers in Europe. Toyota is in a good position with their fleet emissions because they've been selling hybrids for so long. They're not under as much pressure to start selling BEVs in high volumes.

Your first and second paragraph contradict each other. Even though Toyota doesn't offer a single BEV in their lineup, they are completely fine with the stricter emission standards. Nobody is forcing anyone to sell BEVs, what is forced is efficiency. Full BEV is only one way to achieve that goal. Look at Hyundai Ioniq hybrid - a perfectly capable midsize family car, affordable, introduced to the market in 2017. It wil…

Toyota now sells the full-electric Lexus UX 300e in Europe, so it’s no longer true that they “don’t offer a single BEV”.

Re: Sales of electric cars up by 43% in 2020

#159

Post by neuronic » Mon, Jan 25, 2021, 8:16 AM UTC

godmode2019 wrote: post #81

'Global sales' I hope everyone understands in China it is very hard to get a licence plate, the government allows you to get a licence plate if you buy a heavily subsidised electric car. The aim is to stimulate demand to develop an industry. Large cities also banned motorbikes and scooters, with the same aim. This is no way market driven demand, BYD is a very interesting company to look into. It is my understanding t…

Bullshit anti-China post. Electric vehicles sales are rising across the board, not just in autocratic China.

Re: Sales of electric cars up by 43% in 2020

#160

Post by clouddrover » Mon, Jan 25, 2021, 8:17 AM UTC

throwawayzRUU6f wrote: post #157

clouddrover wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Car companies must meet the EU fleet emissions standards and the only way most car companies will achieve that is by selling BEVs. Volkswagen and Renault are the top two BEV makers in Europe. Toyota is in a good position with their fleet emissions because they've been selling hybrids for so long. They're not under as much pressure to start selling BEVs in high volumes.

Your first and second paragraph contradict each other. Even though Toyota doesn't offer a single BEV in their lineup, they are completely fine with the stricter emission standards. Nobody is forcing anyone to sell BEVs, what is forced is efficiency. Full BEV is only one way to achieve that goal. Look at Hyundai Ioniq hybrid - a perfectly capable midsize family car, affordable, introduced to the market in 2017. It wil…

I'm talking about the targets for emissions across the entire fleet, not for the emissions of individual models.

Volkswagen must sell BEVs to meet its fleet emissions standards. Unfortunately for them, they missed their 2020 target so they will be paying a fine:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-volkswagen-emissions-idUS...

Volkswagen doesn't want to waste money on fines so they've made a big commitment to EVs. They've become the biggest BEV maker in Europe and in time they'll be the biggest BEV maker world wide, which isn't that surprising. Volkswagen owns 12 automotive brands and they're the world's biggest car company.