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DeLorean considering all-electric reboot

newdelorean.com

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Re: DeLorean considering all-electric reboot

#131

Post by elihu »

cure wrote: post #33
Armisael16 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They could even do a stickshift EV if they wanted to, though most car companies seem to not think it's worth the complexity/maintenance, and I get the impression that electric motors are hard on transmissions. Electric motors have a wider power band, so there’s less need for gear shifting. They could get more efficiency with multiple gears, but it’s be a smaller benefit than in an ICE vehicle. One of the big early…

> On the other hand, different axles don’t have to use the same gearing ratio. That’s how dual motor Teslas work - the front wheels are geared for higher speeds, and more power is shifted towards those as you go faster. No gear-shifting required. Yep. Alternatively, the Porsche Taycan has an 2-speed transmission gearbox (cf. https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a28903274/porsche-taycan-t... ). I don't think gearboxes ar…

I don't expect stickshift EVs to be common either, but still I think it's surprising that no one has made a non-luxury-car EV that isn't direct drive.

Manual transmissions seem like a pretty mature technology at this point. For any car company that already makes a manual transmission car it would be easy to do. They might change the design a little (maybe 3 speeds instead of 5, and use sturdier gears and different ratios). Clearly you don't need a transmission in an EV, and leaving it out is simpler and less maintenance, but still... if it can be done and it makes for a (in some ways) better or more fun car, then it's a shame no one is doing it yet.

I'm currently working on converting a Mazda RX-8 to electric, keeping the transmission and clutch. It'll be interesting to see what it's like to drive. IIRC, the motor (Netgain Hyper-9 144 volt dual-ended version) has a max RPM of 8000, which is close to the 9000 rpm redline of the rotary it replaces. The motor is a lot less powerful than what you'd find in a typical Tesla (which I attribute mostly to it being designed to run at a lower voltage), but having a gearshift should make up for at least some of the difference.

Re: DeLorean considering all-electric reboot

#132

Post by DC-3 »

mc32 wrote: post #130
dogma1138 wrote: post #3

TBH I’m surprised Musk hasn’t bought them out yet and “released” a limited edition Model 3 with a DeLorian body kit for like $500,000... if Cyan can release a Volvo P1800 for 500K and you usually need to provide the 50 year old P1800 for them to convert and tune there clearly is a market for these things.

What makes the Deloreans so appealing? From what I’m told, it wasn’t very well made and on top of that it was underpowered. So I get the iconic aspect from movie lore. And I get the founder was very... idiosyncratic —and an underdog and ultimately spiraled into making very unfortunate choices. But other than that, what’s the appeal?

They look like spaceships and when you buy one you feel like a king (i.e. you're stealing from the British taxpayer).

Re: DeLorean considering all-electric reboot

#133

Post by jwalton »

elihu wrote: post #131
cure wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> On the other hand, different axles don’t have to use the same gearing ratio. That’s how dual motor Teslas work - the front wheels are geared for higher speeds, and more power is shifted towards those as you go faster. No gear-shifting required. Yep. Alternatively, the Porsche Taycan has an 2-speed transmission gearbox (cf. https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a28903274/porsche-taycan-t... ). I don't think gearboxes ar…

I don't expect stickshift EVs to be common either, but still I think it's surprising that no one has made a non-luxury-car EV that isn't direct drive. Manual transmissions seem like a pretty mature technology at this point. For any car company that already makes a manual transmission car it would be easy to do. They might change the design a little (maybe 3 speeds instead of 5, and use sturdier gears and different ra…

I have a friend who dropped a turbocharged engine out of an old 80s BMW into an RX-8. He ended up having to cut a hole in the firewall and completely redesigning the rack and pinion because the old rack would have gone through the middle of the larger BMW engine. He kept the original gearbox and was always worried the low revving high torque BMW engine was going to murder it. :P

Re: DeLorean considering all-electric reboot

#134

Post by tracedddd »

mc32 wrote: post #130
dogma1138 wrote: post #3

TBH I’m surprised Musk hasn’t bought them out yet and “released” a limited edition Model 3 with a DeLorian body kit for like $500,000... if Cyan can release a Volvo P1800 for 500K and you usually need to provide the 50 year old P1800 for them to convert and tune there clearly is a market for these things.

What makes the Deloreans so appealing? From what I’m told, it wasn’t very well made and on top of that it was underpowered. So I get the iconic aspect from movie lore. And I get the founder was very... idiosyncratic —and an underdog and ultimately spiraled into making very unfortunate choices. But other than that, what’s the appeal?

I love how they look, everything about them from the doors to the instrument panel to the steel body.

I honestly don’t like back to the future much, not more than any other movie, and it’s popularity from that has dissuaded me from buying one (not to mention the soaring prices due to the film.) Nor do I particularly care about the founder or his choices.

For some, the design simply has a great appeal. An EV refresh would be a dream and I would absolutely buy a somewhat overpriced Tesla produced Delorean.

Re: DeLorean considering all-electric reboot

#135

Post by rasz »

Daho0n wrote: post #102
dharmab wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US we find your road safety laws insane as well. It costs 3x as much to DIY fix your own can there as it does here due to needing "approved parts" and an inspection of every repair. Things that are easy, safe and affordable DIY fixes in the US are impossible there. Your laws are not EU-wide, by the way. Most of the EU doesn't require the approved parts to pass inspection, and only requires the inspection at re…

I don't know where you read this but it isn't true. >only requires the inspection at regular intervals, not after every repair. This is how it is in Scandinavian countries too by EU law (well, in EU member states, I don't know about Norway). It is inspection every 4 years or if it is a vintage car (30+ yro) every 8. You also don't need "approved parts" (what does that even mean?) and I can freely buy parts from the U…

>You also don't need "approved parts" (what does that even mean?)

Germany is really crazy about TUV approving everything down to plastic grill. MCM covered it during their visit https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4yO1S-zICX4

Re: DeLorean considering all-electric reboot

#136

Post by piva00 »

abfan1127 wrote: post #32
Armisael16 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They could even do a stickshift EV if they wanted to, though most car companies seem to not think it's worth the complexity/maintenance, and I get the impression that electric motors are hard on transmissions. Electric motors have a wider power band, so there’s less need for gear shifting. They could get more efficiency with multiple gears, but it’s be a smaller benefit than in an ICE vehicle. One of the big early…

is there some type of clutch that allows the rear wheels to free-spin at higher speeds?

Don't know about the Teslas but the Porsche Taycan does exactly that but for energy saving.

Re: DeLorean considering all-electric reboot

#137

Post by dmurray »

Rumudiez wrote: post #60
elihu wrote: post #7

> National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) has completed a regulation permitting low volume motor vehicle manufacturers to begin selling replica cars that resemble vehicles produced at least 25 years ago. Congress enacted a DeLorean Motor Company-backed bill backed by the Specialty Equipment Market Association (SEMA) DeLorean Motor Company, and others into law in 2015, which streamlined requirements for…

> they waive certain modern safety regulations That's not how replica cars work. It's not like anyone in Nascar actually races a stock Toyota Camry -- those are just silhouettes and that's how replicas turn out as well. Visually similar, but completely gutted as soon as you open it up.

And yet...that is what the NHTSA are doing here, and that's what Congress explicitly directed them to do. They decided to "exempt from section 30112(a) of this [safety regulation] not more than 500 replica motor vehicles per year that are manufactured or imported by a low volume manufacturer" [0] so long as the manufacturer registers correctly for the program, affixes the correct stickers, etc.

Some classic "silhouettes" will just be incompatible with modern safety regulations: perhaps there's no room for a side airbag, or the shape of the grille is more lethal to pedestrians than modern cars are allowed.

[0] https://www.congress.gov/bill/114th-congress/house-bill/2675...

Re: DeLorean considering all-electric reboot

#138

Post by red369 »

leetcrew wrote: post #72
madhadron wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I get the impression that electric motors are hard on transmissions. Rather, electric motors don't need transmissions. Transmissions are a workaround for the failings of the internal combustion engine.

they don't need a clutch because they can't stall. but, like ICEs, they cannot make peak power at 0 RPM. unless the vehicle is already traction limited (quite possible), it could accelerate faster with a shorter first gear. my guess is in reality it's usually cheaper to just overbuild the motors than to add lower gears to hit your desired 0-60 time, but this isn't a law of nature.

I'm sure you're right about increasing motor power being cheaper than adding gears, but just thought I'd add that my understanding is that you might then also need to increase battery capacity because the rate at which Li-ion batteries can discharge is another limiting factor. As an example, I think there is a Honda 2 motor hybrid system which can accelerate faster (generate more power on the motor driving the wheels) if using power generated from the petrol engine as well as battery power.

Re: DeLorean considering all-electric reboot

#140

Post by rconti »

elihu wrote: post #7

> National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) has completed a regulation permitting low volume motor vehicle manufacturers to begin selling replica cars that resemble vehicles produced at least 25 years ago. Congress enacted a DeLorean Motor Company-backed bill backed by the Specialty Equipment Market Association (SEMA) DeLorean Motor Company, and others into law in 2015, which streamlined requirements for…

100%. They hit the nail on the head when they said an electric Morgan or Cobra might be a bridge too far, but for the DeLorean, it's a good approach.

The DeLorean was never about the relatively anemic, not particularly inspiring-sounding motor, whereas the combustion engine in the former two vehicles is a big part of the appeal.

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