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Jack Ma makes first live appearance in three months in online meet

reuters.com

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Re: Jack Ma makes first live appearance in three months in online meet

#71

Post by [deleted] »

stelonix wrote: post #62
lxe wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A Chinese person's perspective about China and its politics/government on HN/Reddit? Enjoy the following classics: 1) you're brainwashed. 2) how do you justify the human rights violations? 3) you're a CCP shill 4) Would you publicly curse Xi and denounce the CCP? Good luck!

Okay, maybe I'm missing something, but someone posted[0] that exact phrase #4 at the same time you posted it. What gives? PS: I agree with your points and am saddened the anti-China rhetoric has been flooding HN over the past years. I read a comment here long ago that said "HN is full of neocons" or something like that, but I can't help but believe there's also state backed propaganda (shills) fomenting sinophobia. […

[deleted]

Re: Jack Ma makes first live appearance in three months in online meet

#72

Post by chrischen »

sebmellen wrote: post #36
chrischen wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At this point you're just applying your cultural bias.

Curious how so?

Assuming the standards of appearance for public figures are based on specific people from America of specific ethnic and cultural backgrounds.

I mean if I video conferenced with you right now you'd probably speculate I've been coopted by Communist powers because simply because my background isn't up to your standards (it'd be of a water heater and radon pipes since I'm in the basement).

Re: Jack Ma makes first live appearance in three months in online meet

#73

Post by echelon »

zhdc1 wrote: post #53
echelon wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This regime is no joke. We need to offer Hong Kong and Chinese citizens a fast and easy path to citizenship in the West. If we do not brain drain China, rehabilitate our manufacturing capability, and prevent the CCP's rise to global dominance, we'll all have our liberties threatened. It could start with an offer to Jack Ma. Offer for him to move to SF or Miami. Watch for the "ha, ha, no thanks", but see the impact it…

I generally stay out of speculation and fear mongering, but the fact that your comment has been repeatedly - and quickly - downvoted worries me. The CEO of a $600B global publicly traded company disappeared for several months. This does not explicitly mean that he was detained, but it should be a point of concern. Imagine the outcry if this happened to an American CEO with controversial political opinions (there are…

> I generally stay out of speculation and fear mongering, but the fact that your comment has been repeatedly - and quickly - downvoted worries me.

You should take a look at my post history, then. Any time I express concern over China I'm voted into oblivion.

It's the same with Apple, but that I expect.

Recently I think someone has taken to downvoting entirely innocuous posts I make from my post history. Sometimes I'll post replies to day-old threads and find myself downvoted within half an hour.

You're about to be downvoted too, btw.

Re: Jack Ma makes first live appearance in three months in online meet

#74

Post by edgyquant »

slickrick216 wrote: post #15
sebmellen wrote: post #5

> In the 50-second video, Ma, dressed in a navy pullover, spoke directly to the camera from a room with grey marble walls and a striped carpet. It was not clear from the video or the Tianmu News article where he was speaking from. Uh, resurfacing from a fancy prison cell, perhaps? Can anyone find the video? EDIT: Here's the raw video: https://twitter.com/globaltimesnews/status/13517514568277196... . If you watch his…

But it was alright, everything was alright, the struggle was finished. He had won the victory over himself. He loved Big Brother.

Isn’t it, “he loved the party?” Great line to end the story either way.

Re: Jack Ma makes first live appearance in three months in online meet

#75

Post by murat124 »

FooBarWidget wrote: post #28
sebmellen wrote: post #5

> In the 50-second video, Ma, dressed in a navy pullover, spoke directly to the camera from a room with grey marble walls and a striped carpet. It was not clear from the video or the Tianmu News article where he was speaking from. Uh, resurfacing from a fancy prison cell, perhaps? Can anyone find the video? EDIT: Here's the raw video: https://twitter.com/globaltimesnews/status/13517514568277196... . If you watch his…

How much more mental gymnastics do we need? I think it's time to accept that he WASN'T jailed rather than trying to forcefully shoehorn the facts into a 'but China still bad' narrative. The HN commentary went from 'Jack Ma is a national security threat' to 'Jack Ma is a poor victim of the CCP will will never be seen again' to 'this is fake, he is still jailed'. If he shows up someone else in person next time, will pe…

You may love China but CCP is not China.

Re: Jack Ma makes first live appearance in three months in online meet

#76

Post by hawkice »

FooBarWidget wrote: post #58
hawkice wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read his comments, and have studied Chinese and China for years. While he took a pretty slight risk, (it seems) he only criticized other business owners and potential regulatory ideas. Honestly, his comments were so mild that you'd probably regularly hear similar stuff _coming from the regulators themselves_ in most other countries (developed or no). I'm not sure where on HN you found the sentiment Jack Ma was cons…

> I'm not sure where on HN you found the sentiment Jack Ma was considered a national security threat. During the HN submission about Ant's IPO, before it was halted. For example: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24910410 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24906771

One of those was flagged, so it's pretty clearly "not-HN". The other says it's a state-run business (which, I mean, lots of people disagreed with that). That's miles away from saying something is a security threat [edit: it's worth saying, for those not clicking the link, he compares it to Saudi Aramco, which is, I mean, I've never heard that IPO described as a security threat either, so there's not really even any implications I can detect]. Nowhere in there is the narrative you're describing.

Re: Jack Ma makes first live appearance in three months in online meet

#77

Post by FooBarWidget »

sebmellen wrote: post #56
FooBarWidget wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much more mental gymnastics do we need? I think it's time to accept that he WASN'T jailed rather than trying to forcefully shoehorn the facts into a 'but China still bad' narrative. The HN commentary went from 'Jack Ma is a national security threat' to 'Jack Ma is a poor victim of the CCP will will never be seen again' to 'this is fake, he is still jailed'. If he shows up someone else in person next time, will pe…

With all due respect it seems all of your tweets center around defending the Chinese government. Why??? I mean, saying that: > Many people see the Chinese govt's deficiencies as a result of "evil". I don't really subscribe to that. I think it has more to do with "incompetence". Building a large organization, with the right culture, is hard . is kind of ridiculous. Would you say the same thing about the Soviets (with…

Of course it's ridiculous if you only know China through the media. But have you considered that maybe the media representation is inaccurate? I've actually lived there, my wife comes from there, and my family is still there. This is combined with new information about China coming from the west, and having no restrictions here. I've studied some of China's recent history, a subject which is rarely taught in the west. Why do you think you know the truth better than I do?

> Also, why live in the Netherlands if China is so great? Wouldn't it make sense to move back there, if everything is on the up & up?

Because China wasn't great. I came here in 1993 with my parents, back then China was dirt-poor. My wife came here much more recently, in 2012, and she's of the opinion that the Netherlands is very boring and has no good food compared to China. She'd fly back multiple times a year if she could.

For a more realistic perspective on Chinese society and its changes in the past 20 years, you should read this: The American Dream Is Alive in China https://palladiummag.com/2019/10/11/the-american-dream-is-al...

> is kind of ridiculous.

This is a whole different topic. There's a lot to deconstruct and to respond to in just those few sentences you typed, and those few links you sent. I would be glad to engage with you on this subject, but I have to know something first: do you truly wish for a conversation, or do you just want to stick with your existing opinion?

China has problems, but it isn't the boogeyman the media makes it out to be. When the west better understands China, and when the west and China come together, the whole world wins.

Re: Jack Ma makes first live appearance in three months in online meet

#78

Post by seanmcdirmid »

FooBarWidget wrote: post #28
sebmellen wrote: post #5

> In the 50-second video, Ma, dressed in a navy pullover, spoke directly to the camera from a room with grey marble walls and a striped carpet. It was not clear from the video or the Tianmu News article where he was speaking from. Uh, resurfacing from a fancy prison cell, perhaps? Can anyone find the video? EDIT: Here's the raw video: https://twitter.com/globaltimesnews/status/13517514568277196... . If you watch his…

How much more mental gymnastics do we need? I think it's time to accept that he WASN'T jailed rather than trying to forcefully shoehorn the facts into a 'but China still bad' narrative. The HN commentary went from 'Jack Ma is a national security threat' to 'Jack Ma is a poor victim of the CCP will will never be seen again' to 'this is fake, he is still jailed'. If he shows up someone else in person next time, will pe…

Anyone who is living in China, citizen or expat, is going to toe the party line (literally) since the consequences for not doing so these days can be severe.

We’ve been through this before with other business people or defrocked public officials: Jack Ma is currently having a peaceful relaxing vacation at one of the party’s many secure resorts (Chinese have memes too). Whether he comes out of this like Fan Binbin or not isn’t anything we will know until it happens.

Re: Jack Ma makes first live appearance in three months in online meet

#79

Post by approxim8ion »

echelon wrote: post #39
FooBarWidget wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much more mental gymnastics do we need? I think it's time to accept that he WASN'T jailed rather than trying to forcefully shoehorn the facts into a 'but China still bad' narrative. The HN commentary went from 'Jack Ma is a national security threat' to 'Jack Ma is a poor victim of the CCP will will never be seen again' to 'this is fake, he is still jailed'. If he shows up someone else in person next time, will pe…

> How much more mental gymnastics do we need? > I am from China and I have family in China. Would you publicly curse Xi and denounce the CCP? Please realize also that many in the West (myself included) are freaking out about China and are trying to counter its rise. This is a narrative that fits into their world view. I'm more worried about CCP fascism and hypersonic nukes than I am about climate change. I'm worried…

>Would you publicly curse Xi and denounce the CCP?

What if they don't want to? There is a trend in the west that pretends like dissent would overflow in China if it wasn't suppressed, but what if people genuinely actually like the government? That doesn't seem to fit the narrative that people have the agency to think differently from the status quo Americans would like to impose upon the world.

>I'm worried about what happens when Chinese software developers outnumber us

Is this Great Replacement propaganda?

>When we have no other advantage, what then? Do we implode?

You sit down and try to succeed on merit rather than privilege for once in your life, not unlike the 200-odd countries that aren't superpowers.

Re: Jack Ma makes first live appearance in three months in online meet

#80

Post by sebmellen »

echelon wrote: post #73
zhdc1 wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I generally stay out of speculation and fear mongering, but the fact that your comment has been repeatedly - and quickly - downvoted worries me. The CEO of a $600B global publicly traded company disappeared for several months. This does not explicitly mean that he was detained, but it should be a point of concern. Imagine the outcry if this happened to an American CEO with controversial political opinions (there are…

> I generally stay out of speculation and fear mongering, but the fact that your comment has been repeatedly - and quickly - downvoted worries me. You should take a look at my post history, then. Any time I express concern over China I'm voted into oblivion. It's the same with Apple, but that I expect. Recently I think someone has taken to downvoting entirely innocuous posts I make from my post history. Sometimes I'l…

Just wanted to say I've seen you around HN and respect your principles on this front. Would love to get in touch, contact info is in my profile or I can send you a message if your profile Gmail is accurate.
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