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Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

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Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#621

Post by h_anna_h »

stolen_biscuit wrote: post #534
ganoushoreilly wrote: post #530

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What would have happened if any of the riots this past year escalated to violence because of heavy handed actions of the "left". In fact, we know what happened, death and destruction. Why is this not viewed in the same way? It's a complete attack on our country and government, but was somehow sanctioned?

Because people rioting over centuries of racial abuse and systematic racially motivated murder at the hands of policeman is not the same thing as storming your nations capitol because you don't like the results of a free and fair election

> because you don't like the results of a free and fair election

This is what you think but they do not. They believed that they were protecting the integrity of the elections.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#622

Post by jariel »

caseysoftware wrote: post #581
jariel wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously there wouldn't be '2 Presidents' by any reasonable application of a set of very clear rules. But those rules are not clear. One camp would believe, that Biden won a fair election, as stated by the DOJ, Homeland Security and the State Officals (it's their perogative), and that the preformative process of validating the results in Congress wasn't entirely necessary. The other claim would claim with 'the elect…

Thanks for clarifying. I think your example is perfect: Your conspiracy theory is not based facts, law, or well-established interpretations of either and yet you're fully bought in and sharing it. I see how that could be dangerous, but I think silencing you would be worse for you personally and society as a whole. Just don't threaten violence and we're good.

Answer the question:

'Who would be President on Jan 20?' - if the vote to approve the electoral results on Jan 6th were not completed - or - if the results provided by the states were 'rejected' by a congressional vote.

?

Bonus points if you can tell us how the 20th Amendment clarifies that for us.

Also, irrespective of what the legal outcome might be, what would most US citizens actually believe? Would the losing faction have enough faith in the institutional decisions such that they do not revolt? After all, we just saw a fair election in which ~30% of the electorate 'do not believe' the results.

You do see the 20 000 soldiers out there for inauguration? Why do you suppose they are there?

Finally - here is some background material to help figure out who wins in the end [1]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_coups_and_coup_attempt...

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#623

Post by twirlock »

owlbynight wrote: post #546

I've been on the Internet since before it had pictures. Hosts have always had this power. It's not new. It's not free speech. You pay for a service, you adhere to their rules. You break their rules, you get booted. This argument is a dog whistle defense of terrorism.

Instead of dogwhistle, just say thoughtcrime.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#624

Post by acdha »

ganoushoreilly wrote: post #586
acdha wrote: post #529

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was referring to the specific claim being made in the comment I replied to, and in particular the attempt to present an attempt to use violence to prevent an important government function as no more significant than a street protest. The attack on the Congress was trying to prevent recognizing the legitimate winner of an election, not just drawing attention to a cause in a public place. From that you could easily d…

Call this an insurrection and lambast the crazies for attempting to do whatever it is they were doing, but equally admonish the same that has been transpiring for months. This is no greater a risk or threat than the ongoing actions we've been subjected to for months. It's all chaos and it's chaos that will be used as a means to reign in more control on freedoms and rights.

> This is no greater a risk or threat than the ongoing actions we've been subjected to for months.

When did non-right-wing protesters invade a seat of government? When did they brandish guns while threatening political violence against politicians? When did they reject the results of an election? When did they invade a legislature trying to prevent normal government activities?

More importantly, compare the reactions: when that idiot in Portland started a fire in the street, did they get widespread support? Did pundits and politicians praise them? They faced rejection from local up to national officials: Biden condemned non-peaceful protests but Trump & his allies incited them.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#625

Post by tomc1985 »

noncoml wrote: post #422
apple_innocent wrote: post #337

"In 2010, DNA sequencing company Complete Genomics said that "an interruption of services by Amazon Web Services, on whom we rely to deliver finished genomic data to our customers, would result in our customers not receiving their data on time." Gaming company Zynga warned about how its AWS foundation could quickly vanish when it filed the prospectus for its initial public offering in 2011. "AWS may terminate the agr…

My suggestion that governments shouldn't rely on third-parties for their infra, didn't go down well with HN: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25639520

Well yeah, half the people on here seem to draw their salaries from selling cloud infra

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#626

Post by danielheath »

tjr225 wrote: post #557
Lucasoato wrote: post #554

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your idea is honorable, but do governments have the know-how to do it? It's not only about costs and responsibility, I don't think this could be feasible in most countries, maybe only in China and US.

If they paid better, sure they could. That would require more taxes though.

Not especially. Government has largely predictable load, and hosting on third parties is eyewateringly expensive (only approved suppliers, who overcharge).

In jurisdictions I’m familiar with it would require (nearly impossible) reform of the bureaucracy to make it possible.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#627

Post by XorNot »

smichel17 wrote: post #587
viraptor wrote: post #564

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We're talking about a bunch of delusional LARPers. There were lots of LARPers. There were also some groups moving in organised fashion with less expensive and more useful equipment. There were people with bombs. There were some people ready to inflict harm on LE and luckily they didn't carry on to other people. It was not a homogeneous group with same ideas and goals. That idea is just distracting from what happene…

Can we get some number or range for "lots of"? I imagine those words mean wildly different things (1-2 orders of magnitude) to different people.

I mean pipe bombs were found at both political party headquarters, so how many bombs is enough to be serious?

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#628

Post by didibus »

lisper wrote: post #11

I gotta say, recent events have left me shaken to my core. I thought I believed in free speech, to the point where I started a company dedicated to providing privacy and communications products that were not subject to control by any central authority (that turns out to be very hard!) But watching the events of the past few years unfold I am no longer convinced that this would really make the world a better place. I…

I think what matters is to distinguish between "free speech" and "free propaganda".

What we have today isn't a loss of "free speech", but a surge of "propaganda" by powerful actors and the government.

Really nothing here has to do with "free speech" and everything is about what should be done when people in power start exerting propaganda to reaffirm their rule over others?

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#629

Post by chii »

apple_innocent wrote: post #337

"In 2010, DNA sequencing company Complete Genomics said that "an interruption of services by Amazon Web Services, on whom we rely to deliver finished genomic data to our customers, would result in our customers not receiving their data on time." Gaming company Zynga warned about how its AWS foundation could quickly vanish when it filed the prospectus for its initial public offering in 2011. "AWS may terminate the agr…

> When people debate the merits of "on-prem" versus AWS on HN they rarely focus on the contract terms.

if this had been electricity or water, instead of AWS compute resources, the tune would've been different.

I think the gov't just need to catch up with regulation - that infrastructure/utility providers cannot terminate without cause in the same way that an electrical utility cannot terminate a premise of electricity abruptly and without cause.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#630

Post by rodgerd »

bluescrn wrote: post #156
lisper wrote: post #11

I gotta say, recent events have left me shaken to my core. I thought I believed in free speech, to the point where I started a company dedicated to providing privacy and communications products that were not subject to control by any central authority (that turns out to be very hard!) But watching the events of the past few years unfold I am no longer convinced that this would really make the world a better place. I…

Is the speech really the problem, or the echo chambers within which it is spoken? The marketplace of ideas can't really function if people are only ever presented with a carefully tailored safe/comfortable subset of ideas.

> The marketplace of ideas

It would be great if we had a marketplace of ideas. One where offering arsenic-laced produce got you booted from said market.

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