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The values of Emacs, the Neovim revolution, and the VSCode gorilla

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Re: The values of Emacs, the Neovim revolution, and the VSCode gorilla

#321

Post by arc-in-space »

jpeloquin wrote: post #174
higerordermap wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't quite "get" magit, can someone tell what's great about it / for what type of git workflow?

This is what sold me on magit: 1. In the magit status buffer (equivalent of git status), you can selectively stage changes by highlighting the relevant lines and pressing "a". Basically an interactive git add -p. There's also line-specific unstage and discard. This makes it easy to tidy up before committing. 2. If the cursor is on a commit, commands (show, interactive rebase, push) will take that commit ID as a defau…

>Many git clients will hang on large (> 200 GB) repos; magit doesn't.

Maybe it's worse with other clients(haven't used any, so I wouldn't know) but for me magit does become completely unusable in some situations, like with lots of pending changes.

Re: The values of Emacs, the Neovim revolution, and the VSCode gorilla

#322

Post by kelnos »

nxc18 wrote: post #293
inertiatic wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's very weird. I'm using both, Linux for 8 hours at work and then Windows for my personal computing needs. I live mostly in the browser. Both OSes basically work. I can move my windows around lag free, entirely, always. Bluetooth audio works. This 4k screen I'm using now for the first time on Linux just worked.

Which browser? I find Firefox performance unacceptable on ubunutu. I’ve got an nvidia gpu, it feels like Firefox isn’t using it. Chromium works ok, but I don’t like using chromium. Do you only have the one 4K display? I guess it depends on the apps you use, but I’ve had to set special scaling settings for individual apps, and that breaks down with multiple mixed-DPI displays. Yes Bluetooth audio works, but at least o…

I feel like GPU accel is disabled for most configurations in Firefox on Linux. I had to force-enable it, and perf got quite a bit better (even with dinky Intel graphics).

Re: The values of Emacs, the Neovim revolution, and the VSCode gorilla

#323

Post by [deleted] »

diffeomorphism wrote: post #35
ddek wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Open source is kinda irrelevant IMO. The answer is, of course, it depends . How much do you value language integration? Do you have muscle memory for vim or emacs? There are many more questions here. VSCode supports language server protocol arguably best, because LSP/VSCode/TypeScript were all developed somewhat in parallel. But some languages don't have complete language servers, or already had their own forms of ID…

> Open source is kinda irrelevant IMO. Good tools become even better with time investment. I don't want to invest time into a tool that dies if the dev company loses interest/goes bankrupt/gets bought by oracle/... . Emacs is much older than me and will be around for decades to come. Sublime 2? Probably not. Sublime 3, probably several years. Sublime 4,5,6... who knows.

[deleted]

Re: The values of Emacs, the Neovim revolution, and the VSCode gorilla

#324

Post by dmitriid »

emptysongglass wrote: post #198
hibbelig wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's very interesting. I used Emacs for a long time, but slowly got weaned off it. - I used it for email, then I had to collaborate with people who wrote "please see my comments in orange below". (Of course, they were Outlook users.) Emacs did not show that orange color, so I didn't know... Maybe these days it's possible to read Outlook emails nicely in Emacs. - I used it for development, then the Java software I wor…

I don't understand why people are moving Linux --> Windows. At the company I work for everything is native to Linux--I am floored by the number of interns we get who are using Windows (it's all of them). We have an intake script for getting them up on WSL2 with our stack on top but man these graduates are CompSci people and they did 4 plus years of CompSci using Windows? I can only imagine the pain. Or rather, I know…

> I don't understand why people are moving Linux --> Windows.

Which Linux?

With Windows you can use the Home edition and still have a decent workhorse of a computer.

> A non-WSL2 Windows person doesn't get the benefits of Nix

You greatly overestimate the benefits of Nix to any person. Nix is a fringe on the margins on the footnotes of the world. Even among developers it's barely a curiosity.

> I work in this industry because I love computing. But these Windows jockeys

First thing you have to do is stop being dismissive of people for their choices.

Re: The values of Emacs, the Neovim revolution, and the VSCode gorilla

#325

Post by signal11 »

slightwinder wrote: post #269
signal11 wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Shortcuts in VS Code are a setting. Just load which shortcut-setup you prefer. There are quite a few shortcuts that cannot be implemented due to missing capabilities in VS Code. For example -- this list from an author of a VS Code plugin that emulates Sublime[1]. [1] https://github.com/Microsoft/vscode/issues/3776

Those are very special and seems most of them are fixed/possible already?

Only a few of them are done. The others are marked essentially closed wontfix ("To keep the number of issues in our inbox at a manageable level, we're closing issues that have been on the backlog for a long time")[1] or "write an extension for this"[2].

The bigger issue, which is lost in this forest of Github issues, is that VS Code needs a good hard look at its keyboard and text processing model.

[1] https://github.com/microsoft/vscode/issues/14028

[2] https://github.com/microsoft/vscode/issues/14093

Re: The values of Emacs, the Neovim revolution, and the VSCode gorilla

#326

Post by pjmlp »

adrian_b wrote: post #234
Filligree wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking as someone who regularly attempts to switch back to Linux, I did that because the Windows desktop is a genuinely nicer experience. In no particular order... - The traditional start menu / taskbar is genuinely nicer than what Gnome attempts to force on me. OS X is also genuinely nicer than what Gnome attempts to force on me. I'd take either over Gnome. - The Linux desktop environment is laggy. This is difficu…

While I have to use occasionally Windows for work, on my own desktops and laptops I have used only Linux for almost 20 years and I have not seen any of the problems encountered by you. Your problem with Wayland I could not have seen, because I have not attempted to use Wayland yet, but most of the others seem to be Gnome related. I have never used Gnome, as I have never liked what I have briefly seen in the Linux dis…

My first Linux distribution was Slackware 2.0, offered with the Unleashed Linux book, before I had already get to know UNIX via Xenix and DG/UX.

For a couple of years I subscribed to Linux Journal, faithfully reading every issue, became a Stallman missionary, trying to spread the gospel, even though most of our university assignments were to be done from Windows (W95/WFW 3.11 back then).

Eventually I got tired of choosing configurations and taking care OS distribution bonsai trees, and nowadays just use Mac/Windows/Android (where the Linux kernel use is an implementation detail), leaving Linux for the server room.

Re: The values of Emacs, the Neovim revolution, and the VSCode gorilla

#327

Post by pjmlp »

axaxs wrote: post #238
Filligree wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking as someone who regularly attempts to switch back to Linux, I did that because the Windows desktop is a genuinely nicer experience. In no particular order... - The traditional start menu / taskbar is genuinely nicer than what Gnome attempts to force on me. OS X is also genuinely nicer than what Gnome attempts to force on me. I'd take either over Gnome. - The Linux desktop environment is laggy. This is difficu…

Vanilla Gnome is terrible. You must embrace extensions. At first I loathed the idea, but it's just become part of life. One for a dock, one for weather, one for tray icons, and if you prefer, one for top menu that gives you your more traditional start menu type thing. Or, there's always Xfce or KDE, of course. AMD drivers are now open source and finally working well. Nvidia is not, granted. Bluetooth audio works well…

> AMD drivers are now open source and finally working well.

Only for those using modern cards, my old APU is stuck in GL 3.3, whereas the fxgl supported 4.1.

At least I can use it for GL ES 3.0 coding.

Re: The values of Emacs, the Neovim revolution, and the VSCode gorilla

#328

Post by vbarrielle »

jpeloquin wrote: post #174
higerordermap wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't quite "get" magit, can someone tell what's great about it / for what type of git workflow?

This is what sold me on magit: 1. In the magit status buffer (equivalent of git status), you can selectively stage changes by highlighting the relevant lines and pressing "a". Basically an interactive git add -p. There's also line-specific unstage and discard. This makes it easy to tidy up before committing. 2. If the cursor is on a commit, commands (show, interactive rebase, push) will take that commit ID as a defau…

For vim users fugitive is a very good plugin that does at least some of these (I'm not using it to the full extent of its capacity so I cannot be sure).

Re: The values of Emacs, the Neovim revolution, and the VSCode gorilla

#329

Post by slightwinder »

signal11 wrote: post #325
slightwinder wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those are very special and seems most of them are fixed/possible already?

Only a few of them are done. The others are marked essentially closed wontfix ("To keep the number of issues in our inbox at a manageable level, we're closing issues that have been on the backlog for a long time")[1] or "write an extension for this"[2]. The bigger issue, which is lost in this forest of Github issues, is that VS Code needs a good hard look at its keyboard and text processing model. [1] https://github.…

True, but those are still exotic edge-cases. In terms of shortcut-ability VS Code plays in the top on par with emacs, vim and KDE. You are complaining about the missing 0.1%, not something like >50% of lacking features.

Also, your original complain was that the shortcuts are "arbitrary and don’t seem to be logically organised". This can be fixed by loaading which ever organisation-scheme you prefer. So your actual complain is, it does not match your habits out-of-the-box?

Re: The values of Emacs, the Neovim revolution, and the VSCode gorilla

#330

Post by eadmund »

mbrodersen wrote: post #311
Ericson2314 wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why I work at a place where devs are basically required to use Linux. It's a great filter and training mechanism.

I work at a place where developers have no problem switching between different OS’es. And I would not hire and prefer to not work with developers who refuse to work on anything but a specific OS.

I could be wrong, but it seems like someone who is happy to frequently switch between macOS, Linux & Windows is probably not actually taking advantage of all the features of any of them, and hence is not actually terribly productive (assuming arguendo that those features actually aid productivity).

For my part, I use emacs on Linux because I believe the power of computers is in crafting a personalised productivity enhancer. Free software which can be customised down to a very low level is part of that.

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