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Apple's MacBook revival plan: Bring back old features

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Re: Apple's MacBook revival plan: Bring back old features

#511

Post by mrgordon »

chrisseaton wrote: post #510
mrgordon wrote: post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has nothing to do with syncing. Many people charge their phone off their laptop using the cable.

> Many people charge their phone off their laptop using the (USB-A) cable. Why would you do that? It's going to be super-slow - I don't believe it supports Fast Charging as the port can't handle the minimum 20 W.

Well plugging an iPhone 11 into the wall with the included cable would be 5W and the phone itself only supports up to 18W. So yeah plugging it into the wall will be super slow too.

So yes some people will buy a USB C to lightning cable for their older iPhone and a better wall adapter but most people will just use the included charger.

Re: Apple's MacBook revival plan: Bring back old features

#512

Post by ProZsolt »

Arainach wrote: post #380
oblio wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HDMI will probably be around for TVs, but with USB 4 I imagine we're 5-10 years from most of the current ports going away completely, except for a collection of USB C ports of different levels (3, 3.x, 4).

Other than storage, no peripherals care about USB 4. We can't get away from USB-A because all of the devices that MATTER use it and its variations. Even today no one that I've seen makes a USB-C to USB-Micro (or USB-Mini - yes, I still have multiple products that use that) cable. I have no interest in having to chain multiple adaptors off all my computers for everything I do. Keyboards, mice, printers, cameras, micro…

You mean like this? https://www.cablematters.com/pc-714-123-usb-20-type-c-usb-c-...

And this? https://www.cablematters.com/pc-655-123-usb-20-type-c-usb-c-...

You can even have USB-B: https://www.cablematters.com/pc-652-123-usb-20-type-c-usb-c-...

Re: Apple's MacBook revival plan: Bring back old features

#513

Post by harel »

shrimpx wrote: post #439
harel wrote: post #399

Apple hardware is really top notch. I am a Linux person but if I squint hard enough I can use the Mac OS (with some swearing weaved in). But I cannot use that terrible keyboard. Why do I need key combos for page up/down? Why are they useless buttons like that top squiggle on the top left but no page up/down buttons (there is space for them). Why some things are Cmd+ and some are Ctrl+? Why no key travel?

Btw that squiggle button — I assume you mean ~ — is completely instrumental to programming and using a shell. It’s also the switcher key between windows of the same app (cmd-~ as opposed to cmd-tab).

No I don't mean the Tilda. That is my home man... I'm talking about the symbol I cannot name. Something like § and ±.

Re: Apple's MacBook revival plan: Bring back old features

#514

Post by harel »

helmholtz wrote: post #431
harel wrote: post #399

Apple hardware is really top notch. I am a Linux person but if I squint hard enough I can use the Mac OS (with some swearing weaved in). But I cannot use that terrible keyboard. Why do I need key combos for page up/down? Why are they useless buttons like that top squiggle on the top left but no page up/down buttons (there is space for them). Why some things are Cmd+ and some are Ctrl+? Why no key travel?

I have the newest XPS. It's a 15" laptop, it's huge. And yet, they've gone and put Home and End under F11 and F12. Meanwhile, Printscreen is under F10, which no one needs, and NOTHING is under F9. Also, F5 is covered with the brightness key! I can either refresh or have brightness, while F9, which is used nowhere, is blank. There used to be such a nice last column along the rightmost edge of the keyboard with Home, P…

I've been using Thinkpads for a long time, currently on my second X1. That keyboard is bliss compared to the mac. And I have page up, down, home, end... I feel spoiled for navigation (not to mention actual Function keys).

Re: Apple's MacBook revival plan: Bring back old features

#515

Post by ProZsolt »

rbanffy wrote: post #418
Arainach wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Other than storage, no peripherals care about USB 4. We can't get away from USB-A because all of the devices that MATTER use it and its variations. Even today no one that I've seen makes a USB-C to USB-Micro (or USB-Mini - yes, I still have multiple products that use that) cable. I have no interest in having to chain multiple adaptors off all my computers for everything I do. Keyboards, mice, printers, cameras, micro…

> Even today no one that I've seen makes a USB-C to USB-Micro (or USB-Mini - yes, I still have multiple products that use that) cable Here. You don't need a special cable - you need a small adapter: https://www.wish.com/product/5ae06f0a7ddb0672b9a704b9?share=...

Section 2.2 of the USB Type-C Specification[1] explicitly forbids this kind of adapter:

USB Type-C receptacle to USB legacy adapters are explicitly not defined or allowed. Such adapters would allow many invalid and potentially unsafe cable connections to be constructed by users.

[1]: https://www.usb.org/sites/default/files/USB%20Type-C%20Spec%...

Re: Apple's MacBook revival plan: Bring back old features

#516

Post by gambiting »

behnamoh wrote: post #499
wartijn_ wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that's a weird realization. Those other people don't use those port so they want everyone to have a MacBook without them. You want those port so you want everyone to have a MacBook without them. Or wanting either of those tings is selfish, and you should've realized that what you want is selfish, or both aren't.

You're wrong. What they want literally makes the MBP not usable for many others, whereas what I (and many others) want doesn't affect the usability/performance of the MBP for anyone.

Exactly. If you have a MacBook with two ports and you use only one, the mere presence of the second port has no effect on your life. But if your MacBook only has one port and you need two then it's an actual inconvenience. It's not like we're paying per port of like they are adding weight. It's not cars where everyone's insistence to have cars that can do everything at once leads to some SUV monstrosities which are compromised in many ways, it's a laptop where having literally a modicum of extra functionality has no negative sides whatsoever, I guess apart from people on the internet saying they don't need them so they shouldn't be there.

Re: Apple's MacBook revival plan: Bring back old features

#517

Post by ProZsolt »

justincormack wrote: post #305
smichel17 wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, I mean that I'm dreading the choice between replacing everything and dealing with a hodgepodge of different cables. Right now, all of the "source" devices (for lack of a better word) have USB-A "out" — laptop, desktop, charging bricks — and all the peripherals — phone, tablet, bluetooth speaker, xbox controller… — have USB-Micro "in". Thus, the only type of usb cable that I need is A->Micro. If/when I repla…

You can get USB A to C and vice versa adaptors not cables. They are a bit weird in that you cant plug the cables in both ways up but they do work. More convenient and cheaper than lots more cables (and lots of items have captive cables).

Section 2.2 of the USB Type-C Specification[1] explicitly forbids this kind of adapter:

USB Type-C receptacle to USB legacy adapters are explicitly not defined or allowed. Such adapters would allow many invalid and potentially unsafe cable connections to be constructed by users.

[1]: https://www.usb.org/sites/default/files/USB%20Type-C%20Spec%...

Re: Apple's MacBook revival plan: Bring back old features

#518

Post by ksec »

shrimpx wrote: post #445
yarcob wrote: post #381

The nice thing about my 2015 Macbook Pro is that it's useful without any accessories. I can just throw it in a bag and walk out the door. It's got enough battery life that I usually don't need to bring a charger. It has all the ports that I ever need. I can hook it up to a projector with the built in HDMI port, I can put in the SD card from my camera, or I can quickly copy files from someones thumb drive. I don't nee…

My take is Jony Ive went extreme on form factor and totally lost his grip on users. He wanted an objectively perfect, extremely thin portless wireless machine. Now that he’s gone the design team is descending from the Ivery tower and undoing his work, meeting users halfway again.

It wasn't wrong for the MacBook though. The use of OLED and other modern techniques could have made MacBook even thinner and lighter. And in that extreme, having only one port, butterfly keyboard, and enlarged TrackPad were Trade offs that was understandable.

The problem is they then bring that mentality over to MacBook Air and to the Pro.

TrackPad causes false positives [1], why were they using butterfly keyboard just to get 0.6mm thinner? It was basically all the wrong trade offs.

Oh and the cable were too cramped they failed after closing and opening every day for a year? [2] Which was clearly a design flaws. Not only did they not fix it for free and at try to use the opportunity as good gesture, they actively push their customer for a $700 fix in order to push for services revenue increase. And the problem has been known since 2017. Those report by mainstream media only came in 2019.

And many other things, Post 2016 MacBook Pro was so bad at one point in time 2015 MacBook Pro's 2nd hand price was higher than 2016-2018 MacBook Pro.

[1] https://mjtsai.com/blog/2020/06/10/upgrading-to-a-16-inch-ma...

[2] https://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2019/1/22/18193120/a...

Re: Apple's MacBook revival plan: Bring back old features

#519

Post by sdjkglb »

cehrlich wrote: post #313
cpgonzalez wrote: post #8

The article's criticism of the 12-inch MacBook are preposterous. The 2 lb Macbook is the best laptop I've ever owned, by far. Maybe I'm too sensitive about weight, but I feel an incredible difference between 3 lb and 2 lb laptops, especially if its sitting on your lap for extended periods of time. The keyboard and charger have never once been a hindrance to my workflow, as the article makes it out be. I really wish A…

The 12" MacBook was a fantastic computer. I used one from 2016 until a few weeks ago. However many of the (perfectly reasonable) compromises that Apple made to build this tiny 12" ultraportable also ended up being applied to the rest of the product line, where they just don't make much sense. Specifically the 2016-2019 MacBook Pro were really affected by this.

Yeah, the only people that seem to criticise the 12" macbook are people who've never owned one. I still have my 2016 12" m5 and it is a fantastic little machine for people that need to be mobile.

In fact the other reason I got it was that the rest of the line (in Sept 2016) was not appealing at all. I had been set on a maxed out 13" pro, but hated the touchbar. I thought of the 12" as a stopgap until Apple realised the error of their ways.. turned out I would be waiting half a decade.

Re: Apple's MacBook revival plan: Bring back old features

#520

Post by gumby »

Author seems to hang a lot of faith on rumor. Maybe some of those rumored things will happen, but it's pretty unlikely that all of them will happen. (I'd be OK if the touchbar vanished though!)

Apple just announced a magnetic feature for their phones called "MagSafe". What's the chance that the revived MacBook feature called "MagSafe" won't be something phone related? A charging region on the notebook seems hard to believe but stranger things have shipped.

The author is also quite dismissive of the 12" MacBook which for me was a breakthrough product. I traveled around the world with one in my bag, wrote a ton of code, and often had to check to see if it was in my bag, it was so light. I'd still be using it except it turned out one day not to be rainstorm-proof :-(.

As for the SD slot: I asked Jobs about this in the early 2000s (this was around when PCMCIA was phasing out) and he was dismissive for the same reason: "Oh, you have an SD card? Do you also use CF? And Memory Stick?" This was painful because indeed, I used all three.

The fact is the TB3 (USB4) ports are powerful enough that they can connect to almost anything a user has. I know everybody's milage varies, but for me that's more powerful than a dedicated port I only use occasionally (as FW400 was for me) or never (FW800 in my experience).

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