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Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

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221–230 of 366 posts

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#221
This sucks, since it will probably mean that I can't buy the new all in one apple laptops. Yeah they can't be upgraded (a bit of a bummer), but when was the last time you upgraded any laptop that you owned other than with more RAM, adding an SSD or a new battery? When was the last time you wanted to?

My grandparents old laptop finally died, and they offered me it for parts but I had to straight out tell them that there was nothing on it that was worth anything.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#222
post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The amount of plastic and paper packaging/marketing that you are forced to accept and dispose of when you buy products is getting extreme. I recently bought a micro-sd card, and had to dispose of: 1. the large shipping package, 2. the enormous (in volume and mass) product plastic shell package, 3. the glossy paper marketing insert inside the package, 4. the user’s manual (!), 5. the unwanted microsd-to-sd adapter. Pr…

As a consumer though you could also have bought it in a store or waited until you needed something else as well. I never understood the mindset of buying only a usb-stick or similar online. Yes, the waste is obnoxious, but the consumer isn't always innocent either.

I wonder how far you have to drive to offset the benefit in waste from shipping

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#223
post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a consumer though you could also have bought it in a store or waited until you needed something else as well. I never understood the mindset of buying only a usb-stick or similar online. Yes, the waste is obnoxious, but the consumer isn't always innocent either.

I wonder how far you have to drive to offset the benefit in waste from shipping

Well I hope you wouldn't be making a long trip for the sole purpose of buying an sd-card either.

Some sort of emergency? Sure, but that is hardly the norm.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#224
post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The amount of plastic and paper packaging/marketing that you are forced to accept and dispose of when you buy products is getting extreme. I recently bought a micro-sd card, and had to dispose of: 1. the large shipping package, 2. the enormous (in volume and mass) product plastic shell package, 3. the glossy paper marketing insert inside the package, 4. the user’s manual (!), 5. the unwanted microsd-to-sd adapter. Pr…

As a consumer though you could also have bought it in a store or waited until you needed something else as well. I never understood the mindset of buying only a usb-stick or similar online. Yes, the waste is obnoxious, but the consumer isn't always innocent either.

Ordering 2 items from Amazon will almost certainly result in two separate packages being shipped to you. (At least that’s my experience here in Germany - YMMV.)

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#225
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely. Remember the "2014 Obama Unlocking Law" [1] ? It was supposed to not only not make it ilegal to carrier unlock a phone, but also forced all carriers to adopt a specific code of conduct to assist users with unlocking. Fast forward 6 years, and it is much harder to unlock a phone than it was then. The whole thing backfired for consumers. It was actually easier to unlock a phone in a "non-legal" way before t…

> This mainly applies to US carriers (in the US and Latam), and there certainly are exceptions in Europe where EVERY cell phone is unlocked from day one, regardless of your contractual status. I had no idea this was still a thing, it’s horrible. What mechanism is creating the current situation? Phones are all unlocked here in New Zealand.

> What mechanism is creating the current situation?

Lack of general consumer protection regulation (or their enforcement), and specifically with regards to telecommunications the regulator who's supposed to oversee the field (the FCC in the US, or OFCOM in the UK for example) is often in bed with the companies it's supposed to regulate.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#226
post #224
post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a consumer though you could also have bought it in a store or waited until you needed something else as well. I never understood the mindset of buying only a usb-stick or similar online. Yes, the waste is obnoxious, but the consumer isn't always innocent either.

Ordering 2 items from Amazon will almost certainly result in two separate packages being shipped to you. (At least that’s my experience here in Germany - YMMV.)

Then don't order from amazon.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#227
post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a consumer though you could also have bought it in a store or waited until you needed something else as well. I never understood the mindset of buying only a usb-stick or similar online. Yes, the waste is obnoxious, but the consumer isn't always innocent either.

I wonder how far you have to drive to offset the benefit in waste from shipping

I figure it is a wash. The shipping package can and does get reused, so I’m really complaining about waste items 2-5. Totally useless.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#228

I kind of wonder if we're looking at solving this the wrong way. Instead of mandating that manufacturers take specific steps to fix the waste problem, maybe it would be better to tag items at manufacture and charge device makers a percentage based on how long before it enters the waste stream. Manufacturers could solve this by either: - Making their things easy to repair - Creating in house recycling programs - Makin…

The problem here is with the time delay between manufacturing and the waste, especially as many manufacturers are abroad and short-lived.

It's feasible to enforce repairability conditions and documentation requirements before a device is sold, at the point of manufacture or import - if you're not compliant, you get excluded from the market.

It's not feasible to reliably and effectively enforce consequences for manufacturers years down the road, when it's plausible that the original overseas manufacturer and the importer/wholesale distributor both have shuttered their operations.

We can't wait and see how much waste will be generated from this device, we if we want to charge device makers a percentage based on how long before it enters the waste stream, this needs to be based on an up-front guesstimate - which IMHO is a subjective metric can't be reliable and just invites corruption and abuse.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Local authorities should be able to collect up all Mcdonalds packaging and hand it back to them. Yes, with a bill for the cost of collection and at some point (after repeated failures?), a fine to motivate a course correction.

> after repeated failures? Failure to do what?

Failure to address the problems they are causing.

Eg near me is a nice park. Every single evening the car park gets a dump of McDonalds and Wendy’s rubbish.

Yes, it’s their customers and not them, but if those companies addressed their waste by creating less, making more efficient packaging or finding other ways to improve the situation, they would make way more difference than any customer could.

Re: Europe Is Guaranteeing Citizens the Right to Repair

#230

If you follow the laptop/smart-phone repair community [1], the problems they run into is lack of access to technical manuals, diagnostic tools and in cases, being prevented from buying replacement parts by suppliers under the direction of Apple (for example). To me, it seems that this is where government or industry regulation would be helpful and provide most value with minimal impact on innovation and market disrup…

Europe imposed a standard for phone chargers and thanks to that you don't need a different charger per brand, or even per model, like it was 15 years ago. AFAIK they did not specify the exact standard, except that it has to be some common industry standard, so it did not prevent moving from micro-USB to USB-C (and whatever Apple is using).
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