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Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

cabal.chat

41–50 of 337 posts

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#41
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> knowledgeable, expert Unix user I wouldn't describe myself as that, but I think I'm a little bit past noob at this point. I don't "brush aside" a program because it's node, but it's definitely a strike against it. I don't like dealing with the massive amount of dependencies that always seems to follow along with it.

On Pop!_OS,

    apt show python3-pip
shows six dependencies, while

    apt show npm
shows:

    nodejs (>= 6.11~), ca-certificates, node-abbrev (>= 1.1.1~), node-ajv, node-ansi, node-ansi-regex (>= 3.0~), node-ansi-styles, node-ansistyles, node-aproba, node-archy (>= 1.0~), node-are-we-there-yet, node-asap, node-asn1, node-assert-plus, node-asynckit, node-aws4, node-aws-sign2, node-balanced-match, node-bcrypt-pbkdf, node-bl, node-bluebird, node-boxen, node-brace-expansion, node-builtin-modules, node-builtins, node-cacache, node-call-limit, node-camelcase, node-caseless, node-chalk, node-chownr, node-ci-info, node-cli-boxes, node-cliui, node-clone, node-co, node-color-convert, node-color-name, node-colors, node-columnify, node-combined-stream, node-concat-map, node-concat-stream, node-config-chain, node-configstore, node-console-control-strings, node-copy-concurrently, node-core-util-is, node-crypto-random-string, node-cyclist, node-dashdash, node-debbundle-es-to-primitive, node-debug, node-decamelize, node-deep-extend, node-defaults, node-define-properties, node-delayed-stream, node-delegates, node-detect-indent, node-detect-newline, node-dot-prop, node-duplexer3, node-duplexify, node-ecc-jsbn, node-editor, node-encoding, node-end-of-stream, node-err-code, node-errno, node-es6-promise, node-escape-string-regexp, node-execa, node-extend, node-extsprintf, node-fast-deep-equal, node-find-up, node-flush-write-stream, node-forever-agent, node-form-data, node-from2, node-fs.realpath, node-fs-vacuum, node-fs-write-stream-atomic, node-function-bind, node-gauge, node-genfun, node-get-caller-file, node-getpass, node-glob (>= 7.1.2~), node-got, node-graceful-fs (>= 4.1.11~), node-gyp (>= 3.6.2~), node-har-schema, node-har-validator, node-has-flag, node-has-unicode, node-hosted-git-info (>= 2.6~), node-http-signature, node-iconv-lite, node-iferr, node-import-lazy, node-imurmurhash, node-inflight, node-inherits (>= 2.0.3~), node-ini (>= 1.3.5~), node-invert-kv, node-ip, node-ip-regex, node-isarray, node-isexe, node-is-npm, node-is-obj, node-is-path-inside, node-is-retry-allowed, node-is-stream, node-isstream, node-is-typedarray, node-jsbn, node-jsonparse, node-json-parse-better-errors, node-json-schema, node-json-schema-traverse, node-jsonstream (>= 1.3.2~), node-json-stringify-safe, node-jsprim, node-latest-version, node-lazy-property, node-lcid, node-libnpx, node-locate-path, node-lodash, node-lockfile (>= 1.0.3~), node-lowercase-keys, node-lru-cache (>= 4.1.1~), node-make-dir, node-mem, node-mime, node-mime-types, node-mimic-fn, node-minimatch, node-minimist, node-mississippi, node-mkdirp (>= 0.5.1~), node-move-concurrently, node-ms, node-mute-stream, node-nopt, node-normalize-package-data (>= 2.4~), node-npm-bundled, node-npm-package-arg (>= 6.1.1), node-npmlog (>= 4.1.2~), node-number-is-nan, node-oauth-sign, node-object-assign, node-once (>= 1.4~), node-opener, node-osenv (>= 0.1.5~), node-os-locale, node-os-tmpdir, node-package-json, node-parallel-transform, node-path-exists, node-path-is-absolute, node-path-is-inside, node-promise-inflight, node-promise-retry, node-promzard, node-performance-now, node-p-finally, node-p-is-promise, node-pify, node-p-limit, node-p-locate, node-prepend-http, node-process-nextick-args, node-proto-list, node-prr, node-pseudomap, node-psl, node-pump, node-pumpify, node-punycode, node-qs, node-qw, node-rc, node-read (>= 1.0.7~), node-readable-stream, node-read-package-json (>= 2.0.13~), node-registry-auth-token, node-registry-url, node-require-main-filename, node-require-directory, node-resolve-from (>= 4.0~), node-retry (>= 0.10.1~), node-rimraf (>= 2.6.2~), node-run-queue, node-safe-buffer, node-semver (>= 5.5~), node-set-blocking, node-sha (>= 2.0.1~), node-shebang-command, node-shebang-regex, node-signal-exit, node-slide (>= 1.1.6~), node-sorted-object, node-slash, node-semver-diff, node-spdx-correct, node-spdx-exceptions, node-spdx-expression-parse, node-spdx-license-ids, node-sshpk, node-ssri, node-stream-each, node-stream-iterate, node-stream-shift, node-strict-uri-encode, node-string-decoder, node-string-width, node-strip-ansi (>= 4.0~), node-strip-json-comments, node-strip-eof, node-supports-color, node-tar (>= 4.4~), node-term-size, node-text-table, node-through, node-through2, node-timed-out, node-tough-cookie, node-tunnel-agent, node-tweetnacl, node-typedarray, node-uid-number, node-unique-filename, node-unique-string, node-unpipe, node-url-parse-lax, node-util-deprecate, node-uuid, node-validate-npm-package-name, node-verror, node-which (>= 1.3~), node-which-module, node-wide-align, node-widest-line, node-wrap-ansi, node-wrappy, node-wcwidth.js, node-write-file-atomic, node-xdg-basedir, node-xtend, node-yargs, node-yargs-parser, node-yallist, node-y18n

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#42
post #38

How does peer discovery work? Im assuming there must be some central server(s) to handle the bootstrap? I had a quick scan through the github projects, but couldnt see any high level documentation explaining the architecture. Would appreciate some insight!

"Currently searches across and advertises on the Bittorrent DHT, centralized DNS servers and Multicast DNS simultaneously."

Implementations details can be found on discovery-channel GitHub's [0]

As far as I can tell Cabal uses discovery-swarm [1] for connection management.

[0] https://github.com/maxogden/discovery-channel

[1] https://github.com/mafintosh/discovery-swarm

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#43
post #29
post #19

Just the place to plan a second attack on the Capitol.

Cool, we've jumped right into "if you want to be independent from FaceAppAmaGooMicroTwitBookTube, it's just because you're a right-wing fascist plotting an attack." Way to go everyone.

To be fair, at this moment in time, the vast majority of likely users for a project like this, *are* the Trump/Qanon crowd that feel dejected that they will be held to any sort of accountability for their inflammatory rhetoric, lies and conspiracy theories.

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#44
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Evolution will take care of that. A lot of them will simply fizzle out.

Beware evolution's pruning. It optimises for survival (and as a consequence, reproduction and ruthlessness), which is often at odds with what people value.

I get your point, but a product is only bought or used if people value it in some way (whether for good reasons or bad reasons), so product evolution has people’s values built into the process.

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#45
post #16
post #11

I still don't know what's wrong with IRC.

https://security.stackexchange.com/questions/113532/how-is-i...

Meh. IRC now can use TLS/SSL (Freenode), among SASL.

On X11 vulns, I use a tty, so I don't care, and even on X, xterm has a secure mode.

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#46
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Evolution will take care of that. A lot of them will simply fizzle out.

Beware evolution's pruning. It optimises for survival (and as a consequence, reproduction and ruthlessness), which is often at odds with what people value.

On the other hand, the chat system that "survives" is probably the best one to use in the long-term.

Features, integrations, and a slick UI are great, but without a stable community of maintainers the project if probably not a good candidate for long-term use.

An open, federate-able messaging protocol is also a good thing to have! (email, XMPP, Matrix)

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#47
post #28

This site doesn't render properly on mobile. Many of the blocks flow off the screen to the left and right. I was intrigued, but like many projects, the first impression I got was of sloppy development unable to even test one of the most common ways to view their site and it drove me away.

Which browser? Looks fine for me using latest Edge.

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#48
post #47
post #28

This site doesn't render properly on mobile. Many of the blocks flow off the screen to the left and right. I was intrigued, but like many projects, the first impression I got was of sloppy development unable to even test one of the most common ways to view their site and it drove me away.

Which browser? Looks fine for me using latest Edge.

Not OP but I had the same experience in Safari on iPhone

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#49
post #20

why would I want yet another chat platform when there's already Matrix/IRC/XMPP/telegram/signal, and oh yes, Whatsapp etc?

I should add that Matrix p2p has been demonstrated. My understanding is that it's not ready for prime time just yet, but it works.

Wait, what? Matrix is working on p2p protocols?

Re: Cabal: A peer-to-peer, off-grid, community-first, hackable chat platform

#50
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On Pop!_OS, apt show python3-pip shows six dependencies, while apt show npm shows: nodejs (>= 6.11~), ca-certificates, node-abbrev (>= 1.1.1~), node-ajv, node-ansi, node-ansi-regex (>= 3.0~), node-ansi-styles, node-ansistyles, node-aproba, node-archy (>= 1.0~), node-are-we-there-yet, node-asap, node-asn1, node-assert-plus, node-asynckit, node-aws4, node-aws-sign2, node-balanced-match, node-bcrypt-pbkdf, node-bl, node…

What does that prove? The six dependencies are probably an order of magnitude larger than the NPM ones.

If anything, lots of small dependencies is more Unix-y than one big dependency.

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